Calling All Former and Current NUBAIN Addicts!!

[John Romano]

Let's talk about it... How you started, how far it got out of hand, how you kicked it, if you haven't kicked it maybe we can help.....

[Sistersteel]

Let's talk about it... How you started, how far it got out of hand, how you kicked it, if you haven't kicked it maybe we can help.....



This is the best thing that has ever happened to an online forum. I have always wanted to start a support forum for struggling and recovered addicted athletes. This is huge. Thank you for reaching out.

Hello. I am Sistersteel and I a recovered junkie. Going on 5 years clean and sober. I Direct and run CA/ NA meetings in my area. I hit rock bottom and started digging my grave when I was saved.

Out of respect for non believers I will not go religious on you. But my higher power saved me. I reached out and there was no one there but Him.

Thanks for letting me share.

[BigJD69]

I finally got my hands on some a few months ago. It did nothing for me didn't help me with my neck pain or anyone of my many other injurys. I have heard guys on other boards say that it is an amazing drug that they can train on it and feel great, feel no pain!! Well it wasn't that way for me. It made me a little tired and did very little for my pain!!!

[MRT]

I was never addicted to nubain,but i have been addicted to xanax, i was using it for sleep, after a while i couldn't sleep without it, I didn't get it for any condition i had from a dr i was buying it from a guy who was getting it for anxiety who needed the cash, I'll occasionally have a xanax now, but it's not an everyday thing, and i dont have a need for it anymore.

[Gymdawg]

Well here goes my nightmare started 4 years ago when I thought Nubain was one of the keys to being able to push yourself pass that pain barrier when training boy was I wrong. Being a bodybuilder and been lifting weights since I was 12 years old I have just had that personality to take things to the extreme. Over the last 23 years of my training I sure have learn a lot by making a lot of wrong mistakes. One of the biggest mistakes was trying Nubain it mess my life up and put my life in a downward spy ward. In the end I lost everything my gym.wife, friends and self worth!
In the begin I was taking 10iu's a few times a day and after a few weeks I was finding myself going threw a 10c bottle every 2 days at 50 dollars a pop. This sh$% was taking over my life I was in love with rush that Nubain gave me. Once I started going threw a bottle a day I just couldn’t get that rush anymore so I meet a guy that was raving about GHB and it made him lean so of course I had to try and bang the ghb and the nubain gave me that rush again. But my real night mare was going to begin the Nubain and GHB well went dry and left me feeling like sh%$. I felt like I couldn’t' live without that rush so then began the Oxy and Meth crazy train began. This was the final nail in my coffin once again the Meth and the Oxy gave me rush of being able to do anything just like I felt from the Nubain and GHB. I just love the way that stuff made me feel on top of taking a few good cycles and training I was just getting a crazy rush all the time.
This went on for another 2 years and during this time I lost my gym, my wife, friends and I lost the passion to train my world was just falling apart all around me and I just couldn't stop it! I finally after trying to quit 50 plus times I went to a de-tox out patients for a 12 week program and have been clean for a year now. It's been a tough year and now I'm finally feeling normal again. I'm training to compete this year and I'm 100% focused on staying sober which is the most important thing and working towards my training goals and being the best Trainer/life coach I can be and just like Sister steel said a higher power saved me. Everyone has there way of kicking habits you just have to be honesty with yourself and get help if your abusing it in the way I did. I'm just glad to be alive and I like to Thank John and Dave for there Radio show listening to them over the last year has help get me back training hard and the Keto genetic diet has helped me rebound and I'm starting to build some muscle again! Thanks for letting me share.

[lou0178]

I begged a friend to stop selling it. Long story short there are probably 3 people dead and way more in jail because their addictions turned to heroin. It has ruined many lives.

[Skeptic]

Hello. I am Sistersteel and I a recovered junkie. Going on 5 years clean and sober. I Direct and run CA/ NA meetings in my area. I hit rock bottom and started digging my grave when I was saved.

Out of respect for non believers I will not go religious on you. But my higher power saved me. I reached out and there was no one there but Him.

Thanks for letting me share.

My particular addiction is good old fashioned alcohol. And AA was instrumental in getting me off the sauce. Just over 8 years now.

AA, CA, whatever-A can help. If you are NOT a religious person for whatever reason, do not let that get in the way. I am "pro-reality" by nature which pretty much means a full blown atheist. That does not preclude a belief in a "higher power".

My "higher power" could be, for instance, John Romano. Yeah. That's the ticket!

(so some serious and some fun in the same response - good deal!)

[lou0178]

My particular addiction is good old fashioned alcohol. And AA was instrumental in getting me off the sauce. Just over 8 years now.

AA, CA, whatever-A can help. If you are NOT a religious person for whatever reason, do not let that get in the way. I am "pro-reality" by nature which pretty much means a full blown atheist. That does not preclude a belief in a "higher power".

My "higher power" could be, for instance, John Romano. Yeah. That's the ticket!

(so some serious and some fun in the same response - good deal!)
good post, finally some real insight.

[BigJD69]

Gymdawg I am glad to hear that you a clean and sober keep up the good work. I guess I didn't do enough of it to reap the benefits. Did it take you awhile to build up to 10ius?

[Gymdawg]

Gymdawg I am glad to hear that you a clean and sober keep up the good work. I guess I didn't do enough of it to reap the benefits. Did it take you awhile to build up to 10ius?

Thanks man
No thats what I started at.

[Daniel Minarsky]

Never had experience with it but I just want to write that this motion to help others who might have a problem with it is probably the most beautiful thing I have ever seen on any BB forum...

Makes me glad to be a part of this board. I don't know I guess I am a little mellow today:o

[TRANSMUTATION]

When you realize that the voice in your head that won't shut up is just the ego and an illusion of who you really are, it changes everything...You are then able to recognize the ego in every human and realize its never personal and its also not who they really are...You then begin to understand the ego in yourself and with that, you are able to quiet the voice in your head and just BE...And when that happens, who needs chemicals to alter the true you...

[Zetawill]

Great idea and great post(s).....maybe recovery should be it's own forum! Aaron thanks for sharing your story on the radio show!

[Koubs]

I'd like to thank those who have posted...

Bodybuilders I think by nature kind of have an addicting personality, so i would imagine that addiction to drugs can happen quickly... Reading stuff like this helps me be more focussed to never TRY drugs such as Nubain because of the fear of the consequences later on... Thanks for sharing your experiences guys

[BigJD69]

I live in pain everyday, so I can relate ho easy it is for someone with an addictive personalty to get wrapped up with certain narcotics

[DECABEATZ]

Never tried it but i had battle of my own for a few years on another narcotic. All i can say is since my release from the can a year ago i am doing very well and much better without it! My life for those 3 years and 14 mos of in the can were a living hell. I woke up and reality hit when in the can and have been sober ever since!

[debbiebramwell]

When you realize that the voice in your head that won't shut up is just the ego and an illusion of who you really are, it changes everything...You are then able to recognize the ego in every human and realize its never personal and its also not who they really are...You then begin to understand the ego in yourself and with that, you are able to quiet the voice in your head and just BE...And when that happens, who needs chemicals to alter the true you...

amen to that...;)

[John Romano]

I just dug up an old article I wrote when i was kicking it for the second time. I'll post it up soon as Dave gets back

[DECABEATZ]

Kool!

[Gymdawg]

can't wait to hear your story John

[SonOfPluto]

I too fell pray to the bain as mentioned in the other thread. I remember back in 2000 posting on another board about how I was interested in scoring some of it, and several members warning me not to do it. The following year, I was ordering 20 bottles at a time at 50 dollars a crack. Later that year, I lost my source and ordered some tramadol to ease the withdrawal. Unfortunately, I took too large of a dose of this supposedly "non addictive" drug, tramadol..and discoverd that I could get an opiate like buzz from that also. For years, I wasted thousands of dollars on this stuff by getting multiple online subscriptions. Problems ensued in my marraige related to my abuse of this drug, I was taking 20-30 a day on a daily basis. At one point, my liver count was over 400 and I had to go to the ER because I couldn't use the bathroom. The doctor was clueless of what I was doing and was absolutely convinced that I had hepatitus c (not craig titus thank god, that would have certainly mean't death!). A follow up test rule that out of course. I finally went to rehab at the end of 2005 and was clean for several months but then relapsed. Over the next 3 years, I went through several long relapses, finally in the fall of last year I stopped for good. It makes me sick what I done to myself. I am very fortunate that my body has seemed to have recovered. I pretty much steered away from my bodybuilding as a result of my addiction problems and of course, I wondered how much better my physique would be now If I had stayed the course all along, free of my addiction...

[47ronin]

Along with myself I had 4 friends hooked on bain. Two overdosed from shooting coke and one lost everything he had because he turned to heroin. He said that one morning he woke up and injected 3cc of bain and it did nothing for him so he decided to try something stronger. I was able to get off of it but it wasn't fun. Then a few years later I went through the same thing with g.

[Big Tav]

I'd like to thank those who have posted...

Bodybuilders I think by nature kind of have an addicting personality, so i would imagine that addiction to drugs can happen quickly... Reading stuff like this helps me be more focussed to never TRY drugs such as Nubain because of the fear of the consequences later on... Thanks for sharing your experiences guys

x2

I am like this. Very addicitive personality and I almost get obsessed by thing really easy. No matter what I try I have to go all the way asap with it. I mean if i bought a bike to start riding round my area for some cardio and I bought a GT. It was fine but within 1 month I was on my 3rd Cannondale I shit you not! (Damn Ebay!) andI am also into remote control cars I bought one and within no time I had 4 and all the gear to go with it.

I think bodybuilding goes hand in hand with extreme/addictive personalites for sure.

I got right into going on the gear but I never made the transition to Nubain or harder drugs for some reason I was lucky I didn't see that as a potential next step. I was lucky.

[Aaron Singerman]

I'm really happy to see this forum added to the board! Rec. drug use in bodybuilding has always been the grey-ist of grey areas, but it's an issue that many of us face. Big props to John and Dave for giving us a FORUM to talk about what can be a life-or-death issue!

I, for one, can tell you that I spent much of my adult life battling with one form of drug or another... and have come out the other side alive, healthy, and better off. I'm a prime example of someone that could easily be dead or in prison right now if I hadn't finally got off that spiraling path to no where. I'll let you in on something... I know the secret to how to quit drugs! No, it doesn't include 12 steps or a BIG BOOK... no, not even endless meetings. The trick is to have a HONEST PRIMAL DESIRE TO NOT DO DRUGS. Most people who say they want to quit are just saying that. Deep down inside they know that ONE DAY they'll get loaded again... or maybe in a few years they will be able to smoke a joint every once in a while. That kind of thinking screws people right off the bat. The sad thing is that you can't MAKE someone TRULY WANT TO QUIT (keep in mind, I mean deep down in their soul...). Some people may NEVER really be ready to quit. I'm sorry it isn't an easier solution, but all the meetings and all the steps in the world aren't going to keep you sober if you don't TRULY want it in the first place.

[SonOfPluto]

I'm really happy to see this forum added to the board! Rec. drug use in bodybuilding has always been the grey-ist of grey areas, but it's an issue that many of us face. Big props to John and Dave for giving us a FORUM to talk about what can be a life-or-death issue!

I, for one, can tell you that I spent much of my adult life battling with one form of drug or another... and have come out the other side alive, healthy, and better off. I'm a prime example of someone that could easily be dead or in prison right now if I hadn't finally got off that spiraling path to no where. I'll let you in on something... I know the secret to how to quit drugs! No, it doesn't include 12 steps or a BIG BOOK... no, not even endless meetings. The trick is to have a HONEST PRIMAL DESIRE TO NOT DO DRUGS. Most people who say they want to quit are just saying that. Deep down inside they know that ONE DAY they'll get loaded again... or maybe in a few years they will be able to smoke a joint every once in a while. That kind of thinking screws people right off the bat. The sad thing is that you can't MAKE someone TRULY WANT TO QUIT (keep in mind, I mean deep down in their soul...). Some people may NEVER really be ready to quit. I'm sorry it isn't an easier solution, but all the meetings and all the steps in the world aren't going to keep you sober if you don't TRULY want it in the first place.

I'm a lot like you with respect to my life, and I'm 39 now and finally feel like I really got a handle on it. I'd say it pretty much controlled me from ages 31 up until this year, though It pains me to have to admit up to that. Its great that you came to grips with it as well. Its amazing how good your physique looks considering all the abuse you put it through. Have you every wandered off in your mind and contemplated just how good you would look now if you hadn't used rec. drugs in the first place? I've done this quite a bit, and its really a form of soul-torture, because there is nothing I can really do about it now. MY ultimate belief, is that people often carry over addictions from past lives, and their challenge is to conquer them before they pass over in their current one. This goes for any drug they are addicted to, even nicotine. If they don't succeed in overcoming their addictions, I believe they will be born again into circumstances in their successive lives in which they once again have to confront these issues. But reincarnation is another topic altogether..lol..you could get me rambling for days about this and any issue having to do with the afterlife.

[Big Tav]

I'm really happy to see this forum added to the board! Rec. drug use in bodybuilding has always been the grey-ist of grey areas, but it's an issue that many of us face. Big props to John and Dave for giving us a FORUM to talk about what can be a life-or-death issue!

I, for one, can tell you that I spent much of my adult life battling with one form of drug or another... and have come out the other side alive, healthy, and better off. I'm a prime example of someone that could easily be dead or in prison right now if I hadn't finally got off that spiraling path to no where. I'll let you in on something... I know the secret to how to quit drugs! No, it doesn't include 12 steps or a BIG BOOK... no, not even endless meetings. The trick is to have a HONEST PRIMAL DESIRE TO NOT DO DRUGS. Most people who say they want to quit are just saying that. Deep down inside they know that ONE DAY they'll get loaded again... or maybe in a few years they will be able to smoke a joint every once in a while. That kind of thinking screws people right off the bat. The sad thing is that you can't MAKE someone TRULY WANT TO QUIT (keep in mind, I mean deep down in their soul...). Some people may NEVER really be ready to quit. I'm sorry it isn't an easier solution, but all the meetings and all the steps in the world aren't going to keep you sober if you don't TRULY want it in the first place.

x100! I have a similar story about recreational drugs that got way out of hand (which I don't really want to go into now)but I agree with the above. You either truly want to stop yourself or something/someone stops you first.

You can lead the horse to water...

[Aaron Singerman]

x100! I have a similar story about recreational drugs that got way out of hand (which I don't really want to go into now)but I agree with the above. You either truly want to stop yourself or something/someone stops you first.

You can lead the horse to water...

Exactly... and if the horse isn't thirsty, it won't drink. I know it goes against the grain of many in recovery, but I don't buy the 12 steps or that every addict is the same. People are different, so just because one method works for some people doesn't mean it'll work for everyone. I'm also not a believer in re-habs as they are marketed currently. I will certainly admit that some sort of detox friendly place/environment maybe a necessity for some addicts going through physical withdrawals. A few week clean before re-entering reality can't hurt... but you have to face reality eventually and I'm NOT a believer that the longer you have clean in a sterile environment the better the chances you have of staying clean. These long term in patient facilities are MONEY MAKING BUSINESSES. People are making FORTUNES re-habbing addicts!!!

[SonOfPluto]

Exactly... and if the horse isn't thirsty, it won't drink. I know it goes against the grain of many in recovery, but I don't buy the 12 steps or that every addict is the same. People are different, so just because one method works for some people doesn't mean it'll work for everyone. I'm also not a believer in re-habs as they are marketed currently. I will certainly admit that some sort of detox friendly place/environment maybe a necessity for some addicts going through physical withdrawals. A few week clean before re-entering reality can't hurt... but you have to face reality eventually and I'm NOT a believer that the longer you have clean in a sterile environment the better the chances you have of staying clean. These long term in patient facilities are MONEY MAKING BUSINESSES. People are making FORTUNES re-habbing addicts!!!

Private rehabs are about making as much money as they possibly can. They do this by trying to keep you their for the maximum length your insurance will pay. This is what happened to me back in the fall of 2005 when I went in for opiate addiction. My original assessment was for me to stay a length of 8 to 9 days. They put me on suboxone 4mgs for 4 days, dropped me to 2mgs for a day and then took me completely off from there. I experienced some of the most horrific withdrawal symptoms imaginable, literally shaking in a cold sweat the whole night. I certainly was in no mood to work the program the next day. I tried to get a doctor to put me back on a low dose until I completed the program but he just gave me the run around. This was on day 8 and I had already completed the program anyways. I cornered my social worker and asked her about being released. She started talking really condescending to me and told me that my insurance would cover at least another week and I could expect to stay there until at least then. I said fuck that and discharged myself. The doctor I seen this time when I signed my papers happened to be pretty cool. He prescribed me a small script for suboxone to taper down too. The social worker was really pissed when she found out and started contesting it to the doctor as being AMA (against medical advice). The doctor just blew her off..the mercenary bitch. Too bad she didn't leave any articles of clothing in the staff lounge, cause I most likely would have jissed on it.

[banger]

I'm recovering meth addict/alcoholic.. I've been clean now for 19yrs.

[bigmikecox]

Let's talk about it... How you started, how far it got out of hand, how you kicked it, if you haven't kicked it maybe we can help.....


Used Nubain getting ready for the USA in 1998. I spent more on it than gear!!1 Lucky for me, when it was gone it was gone. Opiates have never been a problem for me thank God.

[Dr. Joel Nathan]

If you have some medical questions on Nubain, I can also field them. It's a seductive drug that is widely used. If you have medical questions on this or detox from Nubain, I'm another resource on the board. PM's are accepted if you want to remain anonymous to the board.

http://forums.rxmuscle.com/forumdisplay.php?f=63

Joel Nathan, MD
Addiction Med doc

[BigJD69]

My Neurologist told me that every human being has nicotine receptors in their brain; the receptors are what makes you addicted to cigarettes as well as narcotics. Dr. Nathan(vo2max) is this true? If so, why is it that I have never been addicted to any drug?

[Sistersteel]

My Neurologist told me that every human being has nicotine receptors in their brain; the receptors are what makes you addicted to cigarettes as well as narcotics. Dr. Nathan(vo2max) is this true? If so, why is it that I have never been addicted to any drug?

Dr. Nathan, forgive me for stepping in, I just wanted to post this article that I came across in my research. Would love to hear your feedback on this study.

“News from the Frontier”
Reprinted from BrainWork, Vol. 14 No. 1 January-February 2004

Why Only Some Become Addicted

Although it may seem obvious that not everyone who drinks becomes an alcoholic, the reason for that difference is anything but obvious. Now, as scientists become more familiar with the biochemistry of both healthy and addicted brains, they are beginning to tease out some of the differences between people who become addicted and those who do not.
At the opening public lecture, Nora Volkow, M.D., Director of the National Institute on Drug Abuse, described her recent work on the biochemical differences between individuals’ brains that may lead one person down the path of addiction while allowing another to sidestep the trouble.
“Drugs themselves are not sufficient to cause addiction,” Volkow says. A person’s environment and genes also influence the likelihood a person will become addicted. With that view in mind, her team has been looking for a biochemical factor that could predispose someone to addiction, something that would be affected by a wide variety of addictive drugs, not just one or two. One protein that fits that description is the dopamine receptor. Dopamine is one of the major neurotransmitters in the brain and is involved in pathways that sense pleasure and reward. The dopamine receptor, D2, lies on the far side of neural synapses in the brain and binds dopamine as it is released by the presynaptic neuron; binding of dopamine by the receptor transmits the electrical activation of one neuron to the next. But when Volkow’s team used a brain imaging technique called positron emission tomography (PET), which enables them to detect the level of a specific molecule such as the D2 receptor, they saw substantial differences between addicts and nonaddicts. Addicts generally have less D2 in their brains than do healthy controls. Interestingly, though, there is overlap, suggesting that D2 levels are not an absolute indicator of addiction. The levels of D2 appear to play a role in addiction, but are not sufficient to cause it, says Volkow.
The level of D2 plays an important role in how someone senses reward or value for a stimulus. At normal levels of D2, most people will feel a sense of pleasure - 2 - or reward from food, social interaction, or sex. If the level of D2 is too low, however, then this sense of reward (or salience, as the scientists term it,) wouldn’t occur in response to such natural stimuli.
Addictive drugs, however, increase the amount of dopamine that is released in the synapse relative to natural stimuli. These unusually high levels of dopamine make up for the lower levels of D2 receptor and induce a sense of salience for the addict, salience they may feel only when they take the drug because other stimuli do not induce adequate stimulation of the dopamine system. To test this model, Volkow asked healthy, nonaddicted people to participate in a study. In the first part of the experiment the researchers determined the level of D2 receptor in each participant’s brain via PET imaging. The volunteers were then given a nonaddictive drug that activates dopaminergic neurons. Half of the subjects liked how it felt and half thought it was unpleasant. When the researchers compared each participant’s emotional response to the drug with his or her level of D2, they found a strong correlation: The people with lower levels of D2 liked the drug, those with higher levels did not.
Volkow says the natural variation in D2 levels in the population may be important for who becomes an addict. For those people with higher D2 levels, the drug stimulus was so strong that they felt uncomfortable and would not be inclined to try it again, but for those with a lower receptor level, the drug created a pleasant sensation.
These data, though interesting, show correlation, not causation, so the team turned to animal studies where they can actively alter the levels of D2 receptor in an animal’s brain and look at the effects. In this study mice were given access to alcohol, which they could drink as they desired. The team then injected a gene into the animals’ brains that encodes the D2 receptor. With this gene delivery system, the amount of D2 in the brain increases 50 percent four days after injection, and by day 10 the level has dropped back to normal. The investigators reinjected the animals on day 20, and again by day 30 levels were normal.
“We see a dramatic change in alcohol consumption,” says Volkow: The 50 percent increase in D2 resulted in a 70 percent drop in alcohol consumption by the animals. “An increase in the D2 receptor has a profound effect on the pattern of alcohol consumption.” Volkow says that this and other work is beginning to draw a picture of why some people become addicted while others do not, and of what happens when they do. Such research, Volkow says, may enable clinicians not only to treat addiction but to prevent it.
Rabiya S. Tuma
© The Dana Press, 2004

[MRT]

I'm recovering meth addict/alcoholic.. I've been clean now for 19yrs.

19 year's LOL i think you are over the recovery stage man ;)

[Sistersteel]

19 year's LOL i think you are over the recovery stage man ;)

You obviously don't know the first thing about recovery, MRT. Most people spend a lifetime in recovery my brother. I hope you can be a little more respectful with your posts in these forums.

SS

[thepump]

i just wanted to say to fellow bodybuilders keep up the good work. stay clean. follow your dream. dont sink.

im proud of every one who has come out and spoke there life. takes guts to do such a thing.