Worst Natural organization

[raylove]

What you think is the most unnatural natural org. I've heard some stories about the TU and the musclemania, so im not sure if i would really even compete in them. Any stories out there where you know someone was saucing or taking something but still placed or won?

[MsGuns]

Ive heard Musclemania has done some tricky things when it comes to testing.

[Steve_Colescott]

At a local contest here, a promoter a few years back made an exception for a competitor that came running in at the last minute and had not been polygraphed. That competitor went on to win the contest. The promoter was a good guy and just didn't want to eliminate someone that had dieted for months and trained for it all year.

The next year, after the polygraph tests were done and the person adminstering the tests packed up his things, the same guy appeared from the back of the auditorium, anxious to defend his title. Turns out he was sitting in the back of the auditorium wearing a hoodie, waiting for the guy to pack up his testing equipment and take off.

This time, the promoter caught the guy on his cell phone, still in the parking lot, and he brought back in the polygraph kit and I am sure you know how that turned out...

[7_Deadly_Sins]

Ive heard Musclemania has done some tricky things when it comes to testing.

Would you mind telling us about musclemania please?

[ANADROLicfreak]

our only show around here is a nga show.it is absolutely horrible.

[~gymdiva~]

if you mean TU as in Team U that's not a natural show...it's "tested" but it's not natural...it's an NPC show...

[The Big Sexy]

At a local contest here, a promoter a few years back made an exception for a competitor that came running in at the last minute and had not been polygraphed. That competitor went on to win the contest. The promoter was a good guy and just didn't want to eliminate someone that had dieted for months and trained for it all year.

The next year, after the polygraph tests were done and the person adminstering the tests packed up his things, the same guy appeared from the back of the auditorium, anxious to defend his title. Turns out he was sitting in the back of the auditorium wearing a hoodie, waiting for the guy to pack up his testing equipment and take off.

This time, the promoter caught the guy on his cell phone, still in the parking lot, and he brought back in the polygraph kit and I am sure you know how that turned out...

I don't get why someone using would enter a natty show - well... I mean, I GET IT... but it just seems really, really low down.

[raylove]

Yea i heard the same thing with Musclemania. NPC you can never really say its truely natural. At the natural michigan only 1-3 ppl got tested per division teens and masters included. And now im starting to hear NGA isn't good either with how the org is being run. I want to persue my natural pro card and have a legit win and card but i also dont want to get screwed politically or by a guy who has been using ya know. Sounds like the OCB and the INBF as well as IFPA is the way to go i guess, to bad there aren't hardly any around michigan i could compete in.

[MsGuns]

Yea i heard the same thing with Musclemania. NPC you can never really say its truely natural. At the natural michigan only 1-3 ppl got tested per division teens and masters included. And now im starting to hear NGA isn't good either with how the org is being run. I want to persue my natural pro card and have a legit win and card but i also dont want to get screwed politically or by a guy who has been using ya know. Sounds like the OCB and the INBF as well as IFPA is the way to go i guess, to bad there aren't hardly any around michigan i could compete in.

Ive heard that Musclemania drug tests everybody but some tests are thrown out. As far as the NGA its the promoters not the org itself. There are some good NGA shows out there. Raylove, sooner or later you are going to have to travel for a Pro show so why not travel for a AM show.
There are some good Canadian orgs as well.

[Team Franco]

I know of a local federation that says they will test, but never do! In fact I know of a couple of guys who use steriods and did the shows. LOL
As long as you know what your getting into, its cool, but not to know is sad from many angles.

[ygbodybuilder10]

if you mean TU as in Team U that's not a natural show...it's "tested" but it's not natural...it's an NPC show...
explain

[tammyp]

explain

they test for substances, but there is no claim you have to be natural. just able to pass the test.

[Philip Ricardo]

Yea i heard the same thing with Musclemania. NPC you can never really say its truely natural. At the natural michigan only 1-3 ppl got tested per division teens and masters included. And now im starting to hear NGA isn't good either with how the org is being run. I want to persue my natural pro card and have a legit win and card but i also dont want to get screwed politically or by a guy who has been using ya know. Sounds like the OCB and the INBF as well as IFPA is the way to go i guess, to bad there aren't hardly any around michigan i could compete in.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------Ive competed with ABA/PNBA, OCB/IFPA, Musclemania, NGA, and Team Universe. To me, the most credible of the 2 that test their athletes are the ABA/PNBA and OCB/IFPA. At Musclemania you consistently see foreign competitors who have roid guts or just dont appear Natural and still compete and win shows. They do test, but its a random test fo ronly certain athletes. They also promise their top athletes lots of things and dont follow thru (this has been going on since Stan Mcquay competed with them back in 1999-2000).
Also, I did one NGA show, and it wasnt bad...great athletes, but all that was done is a polygraph test and the Open Mens winner I knew from the NPC days competing in National qualifiers and there is no way he is Natural (this was November 2006).
Team Universe is hard to tell. I know guys like Kyoshi Moody, Jeff Rodriguez, and some of the regulars are Natural, so I cant say they are not legit either...definitely a different level than some of the others though. I will say (and Kyoshi told me this himself) is once you win your class at the Team U. and go to the World Amateur championships, you will compete with a lot of competitors who are not Natural...definitely not a level playing field for our USA team once they get their.

The ABA and IFPA both do Olympic testing (WADA) so they are legit in my eyes...just my 2 cents!

"Victory is reserved for those who are willing to pay its price"
- Sun Tzu

"We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, therefore is not an act but a habit"
- Aristotle

[Jude2]

For those of you who don't know, Philip is the man in Natural BB.

[Philip Ricardo]

For those of you who don't know, Philip is the man in Natural BB.
---------------------------------------------------------------

Appreciate the props for sure, but Im just trying to stay competitive with the rest of the field. So many greats from the past and present, and with all of these organizations its really hard to tell which ones are legit, competitive, and recognized as the best Federation. Im definitely happy that there are a few choices for drug free Bodybuilders to choose from, however, we still dont get the same recognition that the IFBB Pro's get...but there is a little hope...

"What is a hero? My heroes are the young men who faced the issues of war and possible death, and then weighed those concerns against obligations to their country. Citizen-soldiers, who interrupted their personal and professional lives at their most formative stage... 'not for fame or reward, not for place or for rank, but in simple obedience to duty, as they understood it.
”James Webb, Former Secretary of the Navy"

[Manavs]

based on my experience the worst organization - natural or not for that matter - in each of the following categories:

talent on stage/ lighting/expeditors/promotors/pump room/clarity of information given/promotion/enjoyability for the audience -

hands down over the 60 shows ive attended and competed since 2003 the inbf/wnbf fails miserably to deliver in all above categories

[s2h]

Philip may be the man,but those guts you refer to as "roid guts" are caused by the over use of insulin and HGH.Niether of which are a steriod.As far as natty shows,I just worked w/ a guy for a natty show and he was 100% natty,not even diuretics.I have competed and worked w/ 100's of NOT NATURAL GUYS AND GALS and if the overall winner of that show was a natty,he must be Michael Locketts lil bro.They ALL took a poly and the overall winner also trained at one of the gyms owned by the promoter hahaha ya he's a natty NOT!!!

[Philip Ricardo]

Philip may be the man,but those guts you refer to as "roid guts" are caused by the over use of insulin and HGH.Niether of which are a steriod.As far as natty shows,I just worked w/ a guy for a natty show and he was 100% natty,not even diuretics.I have competed and worked w/ 100's of NOT NATURAL GUYS AND GALS and if the overall winner of that show was a natty,he must be Michael Locketts lil bro.They ALL took a poly and the overall winner also trained at one of the gyms owned by the promoter hahaha ya he's a natty NOT!!!
---------------------------------------------------------------------

I think no matter where you go you will have competitors who make a choice on how they want to build their physiques. I dont want to criticize any of them, because I have met some great physiques and people in general, from 100% natural to those who use illegal drugs, which does include HGH and insulin unless prescribed by doctors, and are banned from most Natural organizations. Basically I feel that if you do use illegal substances or substances banned from certain organizations, including the show that I referenced earlier, dont compete in that organization, period. Thats what the NPC is for.
And Natty shows that only do Polygraphs to tell if someone uses or not leave the door wide open for those who know how to pass the polygraph and want to cheat the system.

"An unarmed man can only flee from evil, and evil is not overcome by fleeing from it.“Jeff Cooper

[Jude2]

You wouldn't be natural if you used diuretics for a show. Juiced guys use them bc of all the water they hold. The natural BB I know don't need diuretics to compete.

[MsGuns]

Great posts Phillip.

[Philip Ricardo]

True indeed. Natural diuretics like dandelion root and Uva Ursi are allowed in these organizations, but no illegal diuretics like Clen or Winstrol or whatever else is used these days.

[Philip Ricardo]

Great posts Phillip.
----------------------------------------------------------

Just trying to keep it real Ms.Guns.

“I don't mind being called tough, because in this racket it's the tough guys who lead the survivors.”General LeMay, USAF

[MsGuns]

----------------------------------------------------------

Just trying to keep it real Ms.Guns.

“I don't mind being called tough, because in this racket it's the tough guys who lead the survivors.”General LeMay, USAF

I appreciate that...

[TyRReLL2oo9]

USBF is full of cheaters!

[MsGuns]

USBF is full of cheaters!

how so?

[LuckyDog]

---------------------------------------------------------------------

I think no matter where you go you will have competitors who make a choice on how they want to build their physiques. I dont want to criticize any of them, because I have met some great physiques and people in general, from 100% natural to those who use illegal drugs, which does include HGH and insulin unless prescribed by doctors, and are banned from most Natural organizations. Basically I feel that if you do use illegal substances or substances banned from certain organizations, including the show that I referenced earlier, dont compete in that organization, period. Thats what the NPC is for.
And Natty shows that only do Polygraphs to tell if someone uses or not leave the door wide open for those who know how to pass the polygraph and want to cheat the system.

"An unarmed man can only flee from evil, and evil is not overcome by fleeing from it.“Jeff Cooper


I think natural or not is a choice. I agree that there are plenty of physiques I respect greatly that I am sure are not my definition of natural. their choice not mine and I have absolutely no problem with that. I would hope integrity would keep people out of federations that don't allow substances they use. I am also not naive enough to believe this is always the case. But I choose to fight my own good fight, to bring the best physique I can bring to the stage and do that in a way that I feel represents all that is great about the sport.

I have also chosen the organization that I compete with based on my belief that it holds the highest level of competition for me as a female bber. I also choose to believe that the majority of my competition has made similar choices, thus allowing myself to not be distracted by nonsense about who is doing what. Let the federation have those worries :p

[AVBG]

I think the worst federations are the ones who skimp on adequate testing... i.e using pregnancy tests, I also think that polygraphs are not good enough particularly if that is all they use to judge someones drug free status.

[TyRReLL2oo9]

how so?
The contest promoters don't test their buddies, even though they admit to taking illegal gear as well as prohormones (which are banned in the organization as well) .

[Yoshe]

based on my experience the worst organization - natural or not for that matter - in each of the following categories:

talent on stage/ lighting/expeditors/promotors/pump room/clarity of information given/promotion/enjoyability for the audience -

hands down over the 60 shows ive attended and competed since 2003 the inbf/wnbf fails miserably to deliver in all above categories

I've competed in the INBF 2x this year and have nothing but good things to say. The lighting was good, the shows were expedited well, the pump rooms were fine, and the clarity of information was top notch (and if I did have any questions, the promoters were easy to get a hold of). The only thing that I agree with you on is the promotion part.

[juggernaut]

Yea i heard the same thing with Musclemania. NPC you can never really say its truely natural. At the natural michigan only 1-3 ppl got tested per division teens and masters included. And now im starting to hear NGA isn't good either with how the org is being run. I want to persue my natural pro card and have a legit win and card but i also dont want to get screwed politically or by a guy who has been using ya know. Sounds like the OCB and the INBF as well as IFPA is the way to go i guess, to bad there aren't hardly any around michigan i could compete in.True that the OCB os the way to go. I was a competitor for a few years. Got treated really nicely. I just didnt like the small crowds and went to an NPC show and was amazed at the difference. Matt Shepley the owner of the OCB is a decent guy too. I'm comitting natty suicide next month, as I want to be bigger and dont want to wait any longer. Plus, I like the fuller look for me.

[MsGuns]

The contest promoters don't test their buddies, even though they admit to taking illegal gear as well as prohormones (which are banned in the organization as well) .

sounds like musclemania...

[juggernaut]

I know of a local federation that says they will test, but never do! In fact I know of a couple of guys who use steriods and did the shows. LOL
As long as you know what your getting into, its cool, but not to know is sad from many angles.I cant understand why some guys do it and then try to pass the poly, and usually wind up not getting first. I mean jesus, you gotta be blind not to tell or even be able to identify juiced versus natty.

[StringerBell]

I cant understand why some guys do it and then try to pass the poly, and usually wind up not getting first. I mean jesus, you gotta be blind not to tell or even be able to identify juiced versus natty.

I don't get it either. It's not like you're getting paid to win the show, no real reward. It's like cheating for the sake of cheating:confused:

[juggernaut]

kinda stupid right?

[Manavs]

I've competed in the INBF 2x this year and have nothing but good things to say. The lighting was good, the shows were expedited well, the pump rooms were fine, and the clarity of information was top notch (and if I did have any questions, the promoters were easy to get a hold of). The only thing that I agree with you on is the promotion part.

which shows? where we're they held?

their "worlds" held at MLK high school in nyc is supposed to be their premier event and it has the worst lighting. they use the home depot 1000 watt lights at the front of the stage and completely washes out everyone, blinds the competitors, and heats the stage. add to that they are asking for stupid poses like calf poses, and hamstring poses, even the smallest of classes are out there for 30-45 mins MELTING under those lights its not good.

i have seen the long island show have a 3.5 hour prejuding for 33 competitors. that is rediculous!:no:

[Joshua H]

ABA/PNBA is not a very well run organization or at least in how it puts on its shows. I went down to Noblesville, IN this June to help with prep of two of my women figure competitors doing their debut contests. They both did figure open. The show started late, and changed the order of classes 3x as well for night show. Not cool for anyone!

The overall turnout was very small as well, 36 total athletes men and women figure and bodybuilding.

They allowed one womens bodybuilder to cross over into figure right at registration the morning of. She ended up being the only women bber in the show and she won of course. She also beat 4 other womens figure girls (2 were mine) somehow despite being an obvious bodybuilder with nothing representative of what figure is supposed to be judged on. Hows that work??

The small little "sales pitch" they kept making on how they wanted athletes to compete in the international competitions was cheesy as hell ("we want you to represent team usa and all natural bodybuilders everywhere") come on for real! Yeah after you pay your own way and raise the funds to do so sure anyone can do that!

I was not happy with my clients placings or the laxity in posing instruction. My clients asked how they preferd to see specific poses in the organization vs the INBF and the co-promoter said, "what ever you choose" that helps with specifics!!

I wont be puting my clients or myself in an ABA/PNBA show ever again.

I will give them props on being a natural org with WADA level drug testing but work needs to be done yet on contest promo and execution.

[Quantum]

---------------------------------------------------------------------

I think no matter where you go you will have competitors who make a choice on how they want to build their physiques. I dont want to criticize any of them, because I have met some great physiques and people in general, from 100% natural to those who use illegal drugs, which does include HGH and insulin unless prescribed by doctors, and are banned from most Natural organizations. Basically I feel that if you do use illegal substances or substances banned from certain organizations, including the show that I referenced earlier, dont compete in that organization, period. Thats what the NPC is for.
And Natty shows that only do Polygraphs to tell if someone uses or not leave the door wide open for those who know how to pass the polygraph and want to cheat the system.

"An unarmed man can only flee from evil, and evil is not overcome by fleeing from it.“Jeff Cooper


Inslulin can be bought legally without prescription. I am a pharmaceutical technition. There are two or three Jr. National/National level competitors in my local area who regulary buy it from the store I work out. Let them dig their own graves with those 21" guns they are obsessed with.

[Yoshe]

Double Post

[Yoshe]

which shows? where we're they held?

their "worlds" held at MLK high school in nyc is supposed to be their premier event and it has the worst lighting. they use the home depot 1000 watt lights at the front of the stage and completely washes out everyone, blinds the competitors, and heats the stage. add to that they are asking for stupid poses like calf poses, and hamstring poses, even the smallest of classes are out there for 30-45 mins MELTING under those lights its not good.

i have seen the long island show have a 3.5 hour prejuding for 33 competitors. that is rediculous!:no:

I competed in the Northeast America (Matawan, NJ; April 25th) and the Natural North America (Falls Church, VA; May 30th).

The lighting wasn't the best I've ever seen, but it wasn't horrible. I will agree that they do tend to keep the competitors out on stage forever, but at the shows I was at no one was required to hit any calf/hamstring poses...and at least they do compare everyone evenly (they move everyone around so that they all get compared to each other).

[Manavs]

I competed in the Northeast America (Matawan, NJ; April 25th) and the Natural North America (Falls Church, VA; May 30th).

The lighting wasn't the best I've ever seen, but it wasn't horrible. I will agree that they do tend to keep the competitors out on stage forever, but at the shows I was at no one was required to hit any calf/hamstring poses...and at least they do compare everyone evenly (they move everyone around so that they all get compared to each other).

Ive went to the 2007 INBF Natural Northeast America in matawan - i highlighted in the attached photo the lighting they used. those are 1000watt halogen lights that wash out competitors and unfortunately they are from below. they weren't be that bad if they were hung from above creating a proper angled lighting/shadow.

also note the pose - yep rear calf pose.

i also remember emailing with the head of the inbf to see the scorecards of my buddy who competed - you would think i was asking for sealed medical records! but thats another story all together.

i think competitors work too hard to have to subject themselves to bad competitive conditions when its not rocket science their after:
-have good communication
-have good expediters in the pump room, side stage and on stage
-have good lighting
-have a good backstage area
-move the show along
-dont make it about themselves (the promotors)

[matt1005]

Ive went to the 2007 INBF Natural Northeast America in matawan - i highlighted in the attached photo the lighting they used. those are 1000watt halogen lights that wash out competitors and unfortunately they are from below. they weren't be that bad if they were hung from above creating a proper angled lighting/shadow.

also note the pose - yep rear calf pose.

i also remember emailing with the head of the inbf to see the scorecards of my buddy who competed - you would think i was asking for sealed medical records! but thats another story all together.

i think competitors work too hard to have to subject themselves to bad competitive conditions when its not rocket science their after:
-have good communication
-have good expediters in the pump room, side stage and on stage
-have good lighting
-have a good backstage area
-move the show along
-dont make it about themselves (the promotors)
I have seen the last one before. It is so irritating that I will never do another one of the guys shows (hopefully at least).

[sjl_bantam]

-----------------------------------------------------------------------Ive competed with ABA/PNBA, OCB/IFPA, Musclemania, NGA, and Team Universe. To me, the most credible of the 2 that test their athletes are the ABA/PNBA and OCB/IFPA. At Musclemania you consistently see foreign competitors who have roid guts or just dont appear Natural and still compete and win shows. They do test, but its a random test fo ronly certain athletes. They also promise their top athletes lots of things and dont follow thru (this has been going on since Stan Mcquay competed with them back in 1999-2000).
Also, I did one NGA show, and it wasnt bad...great athletes, but all that was done is a polygraph test and the Open Mens winner I knew from the NPC days competing in National qualifiers and there is no way he is Natural (this was November 2006).
Team Universe is hard to tell. I know guys like Kyoshi Moody, Jeff Rodriguez, and some of the regulars are Natural, so I cant say they are not legit either...definitely a different level than some of the others though. I will say (and Kyoshi told me this himself) is once you win your class at the Team U. and go to the World Amateur championships, you will compete with a lot of competitors who are not Natural...definitely not a level playing field for our USA team once they get their.

The ABA and IFPA both do Olympic testing (WADA) so they are legit in my eyes...just my 2 cents!

"Victory is reserved for those who are willing to pay its price"
- Sun Tzu

"We are what we repeatedly do. Excellence, therefore is not an act but a habit"
- Aristotle



agreed, I'm going to the World Championships and I'd been warned by more than one competitor at the Team U that the testing for the Worlds was suspect. On the IFBB website it touts the show as being WADA complaint and all that jazz but then goes on to state that testing is random, weighted or targeted. I've been to local shows where EVERYONE is tested so I can 't imagine its too cost prohibitive to test everyone, at least not on the "World" level were they're footing the bill for so many other things to enhance the show. I did notice, however, looking at the contest results from years past a few people have been disqualified so maybe they are catching some!

[Manavs]

agreed, I'm going to the World Championships and I'd been warned by more than one competitor at the Team U that the testing for the Worlds was suspect. On the IFBB website it touts the show as being WADA complaint and all that jazz but then goes on to state that testing is random, weighted or targeted. I've been to local shows where EVERYONE is tested so I can 't imagine its too cost prohibitive to test everyone, at least not on the "World" level were they're footing the bill for so many other things to enhance the show. I did notice, however, looking at the contest results from years past a few people have been disqualified so maybe they are catching some!

sjl, I saw you at Team U, you looked great congrats! all the best at the worlds!

[RDFinders]

Inslulin can be bought legally without prescription. I am a pharmaceutical technition. There are two or three Jr. National/National level competitors in my local area who regulary buy it from the store I work out. Let them dig their own graves with those 21" guns they are obsessed with.
that's only NPH and regular. lente, ultralente, lantus and rapid - humalog or novalog has be purchased with a Rx.

[bndniron4evrgal]

ANGELA MRAZ was a PRO in ??? natural division.

don't know the story, but she is now competing in the NPC figure division, well lets call it the IFBB because she has already made it to the PRO LEVEL.

if anybody has more info on why she changed over let's hear it......

[MsGuns]

ANGELA MRAZ was a PRO in ??? natural division.

don't know the story, but she is now competing in the NPC figure division, well lets call it the IFBB because she has already made it to the PRO LEVEL.

if anybody has more info on why she changed over let's hear it......

Its in the Team U thread...
WNBF has a lot of restrictions on their athletes.
Something w/ her sponsor supplement co, WNBF didnt like. Some BS if you ask me.

[JohnnyMuscles]

ANGELA MRAZ was a PRO in ??? natural division.

don't know the story, but she is now competing in the NPC figure division, well lets call it the IFBB because she has already made it to the PRO LEVEL.

if anybody has more info on why she changed over let's hear it......

I found this.....

http://australian-bodybuilding.com/forum/fitness-figure-physique/642-world-natural-bodybuilding-federation-bans-their-4-time-figure-world-champ-angela-mraz.html

[flaccid_member]

which shows? where we're they held?

their "worlds" held at MLK high school in nyc is supposed to be their premier event and it has the worst lighting. they use the home depot 1000 watt lights at the front of the stage and completely washes out everyone, blinds the competitors, and heats the stage. add to that they are asking for stupid poses like calf poses, and hamstring poses, even the smallest of classes are out there for 30-45 mins MELTING under those lights its not good.

i have seen the long island show have a 3.5 hour prejuding for 33 competitors. that is rediculous!:no:


I have seen the last one before. It is so irritating that I will never do another one of the guys shows (hopefully at least).


ANGELA MRAZ was a PRO in ??? natural division.

don't know the story, but she is now competing in the NPC figure division, well lets call it the IFBB because she has already made it to the PRO LEVEL.

if anybody has more info on why she changed over let's hear it......


Its in the Team U thread...
WNBF has a lot of restrictions on their athletes.
Something w/ her sponsor supplement co, WNBF didnt like. Some BS if you ask me.

So the topic is the worst organization to compete in. Funny. I think we have a winner, folks! It's sad to see when certain organizations shoot themselves in the foot. Check this thread out and hopefully it will add insight to what most of you might have figured out. For the newbies on here, like anything in life, choose which organization works for you.

WNBF / INBF...are they retarded? - RX Muscle Forums

Juggernaut made a great point as well:

True that the OCB os the way to go. I was a competitor for a few years. Got treated really nicely. I just didnt like the small crowds and went to an NPC show and was amazed at the difference. Matt Shepley the owner of the OCB is a decent guy too. :yep:

[joelster]

Who deleted my post?

[werfewgrt]

No such thing as NATURAL BODYBUILDING PERIOD.
NATURAL means no drugs, no supplements, no diuretics, no "legal" herbs and ........
All you so called NATURALS stop bull shitting because I KNOW what really is going on.

[matt1005]

No such thing as NATURAL BODYBUILDING PERIOD.
NATURAL means no drugs, no supplements, no diuretics, no "legal" herbs and ........
All you so called NATURALS stop bull shitting because I KNOW what really is going on.
Thank goodness you KNOW...and also enlightening everybody.

[joelster]

Well, I see that my last post was deleted, lol. I guess you aren't allowed to say anything negative about the NGA. I have nothing against the NGA itself, just one particular promoter in my area that simply sucks. I won't group every NGA show together, because each individual promoter has their own way of doing things. I think some of you guys are blindly grouping organizations based on one local show that you went to or competed in. You may have a bad local INBF promoter so you assume all INBF shows suck, but that is not the case. In the western, NY area where I am from, the local INBF shows are excellent. The promoters of these shows are WNBF pros themselves, and from what I have seen, they go above and beyond to help the competitors. Participation awards to ALL competitors, huge goodie bags, huge trophies, etc..Maybe that is the reason why we have 3 INBF shows now, when 2 years ago we only had 1. I just went to a local show on October 10th and it was the best show i've ever been to, I made another thread about it in here.

[flaccid_member]

No such thing as NATURAL BODYBUILDING PERIOD.
NATURAL means no drugs, no supplements, no diuretics, no "legal" herbs and ........
All you so called NATURALS stop bull shitting because I KNOW what really is going on.


Thank goodness you KNOW...and also enlightening everybody.

OMFG! I've been using GH all of this time by eating unorganic chicken and beef! Great googily moogily, I knew I wasn't a natty! Call a spade a spade because I am officially enlightened!

All "natties..." go back into hiding; we've been caught. :sad::police:
Werfewgrt, I am assuming you are/were a competitor or an athlete, so you speak from experience.

[AVBG]

"You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to theblemishedone again."

[werfewgrt]

"You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to theblemishedone again."
lol I'm just saying

[AVBG]

lol I'm just saying

quite entitled to your opinion..(even when wrong) ;)

[flaccid_member]

Getting back to things, you will see what is what around here. I will be posting names after the fact to protect the interests of these competitors, many of whom are associates and friends. People are entitled to their opinions, and I may not always agree, but I respect them nonetheless.

[flaccid_member]

Well, I see that my last post was deleted, lol. I guess you aren't allowed to say anything negative about the NGA. I have nothing against the NGA itself, just one particular promoter in my area that simply sucks. I won't group every NGA show together, because each individual promoter has their own way of doing things. I think some of you guys are blindly grouping organizations based on one local show that you went to or competed in. You may have a bad local INBF promoter so you assume all INBF shows suck, but that is not the case. In the western, NY area where I am from, the local INBF shows are excellent. The promoters of these shows are WNBF pros themselves, and from what I have seen, they go above and beyond to help the competitors. Participation awards to ALL competitors, huge goodie bags, huge trophies, etc..Maybe that is the reason why we have 3 INBF shows now, when 2 years ago we only had 1. I just went to a local show on October 10th and it was the best show i've ever been to, I made another thread about it in here.

Joelster, I agree 100 percent. It all boils down to the promoter. However, when the athletes are treated like cattle and prostitutes after the fact, it becomes a different story altogether.

I know the promoters you are talking about. They know me quite well. I will hopefully be catching all 3 of them here in NYC in 2 weeks, so it should be an awesome reunion, for sure! They are great people first and foremost. The biggest reason their shows succeed?

1: They bust their asses.
2: They make the shows both competitor and fan-friendly.
3: They design their shows the way they would want to be treated.
4: They have pride.
5: They are competitors, so they understand the needs and wants of a competitor.

It makes life easier when you have an organization backing you. I would like to see those promoters move on to another organization as I feel they would have greater success both as promoters and competitors. Don't worry; it's only a matter of time before they see the light. :)

[raylove]

No such thing as NATURAL BODYBUILDING PERIOD.
NATURAL means no drugs, no supplements, no diuretics, no "legal" herbs and ........
All you so called NATURALS stop bull shitting because I KNOW what really is going on.

Dude all that statement does is make you look like an ass and make you look like you arent natural or w/e you want to call it so i dont even know why you are in this section of the threads????

The whole pt was to find out which org i should compete in not defend myself in calling me natural or w/e so shut ignorant boastful ass up

[raylove]

To the ppl that actually replied to the topic of the thread thank you for your input its slowly helping me decide what to compete in. I feel i have a good chance to turn pro as a natural but i just dont know what show to do or where to go for a good show. I was thinking about Dr. Joe's show in IN n July and then try some other ones if i dont win there in the fall or later summer.

Do you know if the orgs will let you compete if a prohormone was taken up to 2 years prior to competing in a nat event. I took a prohormone off dave's site in the fall/winter of 07/08 and dieted all the muscle i added off to get shredded any way lol though i know that doesnt matter. Can anyone help with that? Not sure what orgs say no to what....

[flaccid_member]

To the ppl that actually replied to the topic of the thread thank you for your input its slowly helping me decide what to compete in. I feel i have a good chance to turn pro as a natural but i just dont know what show to do or where to go for a good show. I was thinking about Dr. Joe's show in IN n July and then try some other ones if i dont win there in the fall or later summer.

Do you know if the orgs will let you compete if a prohormone was taken up to 2 years prior to competing in a nat event. I took a prohormone off dave's site in the fall/winter of 07/08 and dieted all the muscle i added off to get shredded any way lol though i know that doesnt matter. Can anyone help with that? Not sure what orgs say no to what....

What part of the midwest are you located in?

[NATURAL-1987]

To the ppl that actually replied to the topic of the thread thank you for your input its slowly helping me decide what to compete in. I feel i have a good chance to turn pro as a natural but i just dont know what show to do or where to go for a good show. I was thinking about Dr. Joe's show in IN n July and then try some other ones if i dont win there in the fall or later summer.

Do you know if the orgs will let you compete if a prohormone was taken up to 2 years prior to competing in a nat event. I took a prohormone off dave's site in the fall/winter of 07/08 and dieted all the muscle i added off to get shredded any way lol though i know that doesnt matter. Can anyone help with that? Not sure what orgs say no to what....

I believe it depends on the organization. I asked the NGA about a basic rule of thumb and they said, anything over the counter is ok. However, you have to make sure you can pass a U/A as well so know what your putting into your body and if it may cause false positive kind of thing. Hope this helps.

[joelster]

To the ppl that actually replied to the topic of the thread thank you for your input its slowly helping me decide what to compete in. I feel i have a good chance to turn pro as a natural but i just dont know what show to do or where to go for a good show. I was thinking about Dr. Joe's show in IN n July and then try some other ones if i dont win there in the fall or later summer.

Do you know if the orgs will let you compete if a prohormone was taken up to 2 years prior to competing in a nat event. I took a prohormone off dave's site in the fall/winter of 07/08 and dieted all the muscle i added off to get shredded any way lol though i know that doesnt matter. Can anyone help with that? Not sure what orgs say no to what....

The INBF is VERY strict. Here is their banned list right here:

http://www.wnbf.net/drug-free.html

I guess you "should" be ok on the pro-hormone thing. Here is a clip from their banned list:

INBF COMPETITOR’S ONLY – Any athletes who are new the INBF must have not used any prohormones for at least two (2) years before joining the INBF for the first time.

But keep this in mind:
TESTOSTERONE/EPITESTOSTERONE (T/E) RATIO – The T/E ratio is used to measure the presence of exogenous testosterone or illicit elevation of testosterone levels. A T/E ratio in excess of 6/1 is ruled as positive, no matter what the cause. Note: Should the use of any substance cause a T/E ratio in excess of the 6/1 limit, the athlete will be ruled as positive (failure).

That means that if you win an INBF show and your urinalysis comes back excessive, you are booted.


NGA is about as loose as you can get for a "natural" show. If you can legally buy it, it is fair game in the NGA. This will hinder you if you decide to do ohter natural shows, so be careful what you choose to cunsume. Mainly you have to be picky with your fat burners, and avoid ANY pro-hormones.

Check with people who have done the very show you wish to do and see how they felt about the competition there and how the promoter ran it. That is the best advice you can get.

[ygbodybuilder10]

if you mean TU as in Team U that's not a natural show...it's "tested" but it's not natural...it's an NPC show...
well what do they test for

[Jude2]

It suppose to be natural, just ask the womens overall winner who got DQ.

[DaveB1984]

NGA has done a great job in NY

[SC_Bbing]

What does any of u guys think of the INBA in texas there shows her r rare.

[MsGuns]

What does any of u guys think of the INBA in texas there shows her r rare.

I dont think there are any INBA shows but there is an INBF show in San Antonio.

[raylove]

What part of the midwest are you located in?

Hey sorry everyone im not on here enough but i got so much goin on with school. Im from michigan around metro detroit btw. Im looking into the pro qualifier in late july in indiana that Dr. Joe K is promoting or something. I feel i've been putting on good size and its been 2 years since ive taken the prohormones and i pretty much dieted any muscle gain i got from it for the show i did after i used it lol. Since then i havent taken anything to effect my physique over a long time. I feel i can win a natural pro card soon i just dont want something i did a few years back to effect the outcome if its in my favor or anything and have my past haunt me.

But also i dont want guys coming off cycles of stuff entering natural shows and beating me out too. So idk i might try for the INBF or WNBF and see how i fair. I feel my body would pass the U/A as well since it hasnt had anything you could call not natural in over 2 years...