Nutrition for Optimal Performance

[Sistersteel]

It is important to decipher between eating for aesthetics and eating for performance. When the ultimate goal is speed, power, strength, being too lean showing muscular striations is not a primary concern. The ultimate requirement is performance. Weight control and strength to weight ratios can be very important, especially in activities that require manipulation of the body. But many athletes get caught up in the struggle of body image especially those among us who come from a bodybuilding background and still have bodybuilding habits. The athletes are often torn between perceived societal expectations and their own body image. This is not to be taken as an open invitation to gorging oneself in the name of performance, but many athletes often miss out on their ultimate goal for a couple percent of body fat. Nutrition and nutrition timing have a HUGE impact on a strength athlete's performance. Proper nutrition is crucial, before, during and after a meet as well as in the offseason. So let's all talk about what we are currently doing to improve our performance and how we can improve on our habits to excel in our sport, whether on the Oly lifting platforms, under bending bars or pulling a 747. Let's talk about it.

SS

[DCHMUSCLE88]

amen to that sister

[crashcrew56]

I'm still working on trying to get on an optimal nutritional program for strength training, I'm stuck in bb nutritional habits.

[Frosty]

In my opinion the diet that gives you the best mental function is going to be excellent for strength gains. Strength to a high degree is more neurological than muscular so a diet that improves mental function just makes sense. Some guys that have done keto to cut and felt great should take note....they just need to eat a LOT more for getting strong, but of the same kinds of food. Another benefit to a lot of these guys is that it may help them keep within weight classes and not gain so much fat while eating large quantities of food for strength. Some proteins are more stimulating like beef and eggs which should also be kept in mind. I personally think protein and amino acids are big players in strength. Many amino acids can be almost directly stimulating for strength and others like BCAAs (leucine the main player) around workout time can help improve strength.

I'm not suggesting a low carb diet as the only way, but more like an option for most people that they might not consider because they think you need to eat a lot of carbs for strength. If you don't function well on carb diets then you have no business eating that way for strength gains! Now if you're a carb type then by all means eat carbs, but try to stick with ones that will allow for more stable blood sugar levels meaning staying away from refined carbs.

[Sistersteel]

In my opinion the diet that gives you the best mental function is going to be excellent for strength gains. Strength to a high degree is more neurological than muscular so a diet that improves mental function just makes sense. Some guys that have done keto to cut and felt great should take note....they just need to eat a LOT more for getting strong, but of the same kinds of food. Another benefit to a lot of these guys is that it may help them keep within weight classes and not gain so much fat while eating large quantities of food for strength. Some proteins are more stimulating like beef and eggs which should also be kept in mind. I personally think protein and amino acids are big players in strength. Many amino acids can be almost directly stimulating for strength and others like BCAAs (leucine the main player) around workout time can help improve strength.

I'm not suggesting a low carb diet as the only way, but more like an option for most people that they might not consider because they think you need to eat a lot of carbs for strength. If you don't function well on carb diets then you have no business eating that way for strength gains! Now if you're a carb type then by all means eat carbs, but try to stick with ones that will allow for more stable blood sugar levels meaning staying away from refined carbs.

Interestingly enough, Frosty, I have realized that carbs are a very essential part of my diet. In fact, I just recently switched complex carbs for simple carbs and have been able to maintain lower bodyfat while conserving strength and improving performance. Plus the simple carbs create this surge of energy which does wonders for me on the platfirm even if I were carb depelted for days. It is just the strangest thing. I can drink 3 gallons of orange juice over the course of a weekend and still wakeup on Monday morning leaner and tighter. I can consume thousands of calories in proteins alone and not look half as good or perfrom half as well.

[Frosty]

Huh, very interesting. If I did the same I'd be a bloated mess after the weekend :)

[Sistersteel]

Can we get some arguments going here from everyone on why keto is or is NOT a good option for an athlete trying to increase strength and imrpove performance?

[tjoe]

arguments... I doubt it.
personal preference and trial and error.
I love some simple sugars... and it SHOWS!
Keto, I didn't really lose strength last time until I really got deep into the diet (about 4-5 months)

One thing I will say should be really focused on... FATS.
great source of energy, extra calories, important for hormones etc.
I would say "mostly" healthy but the occasional "crap" helps too.

true story...
I had one of my clients stop at McDonalds before he would come in to train (about 1hr prior)... He was working on his bench. He made steady increases EVERY time in for about 2 months straight. Good diet the rest of the time.
he just started trying to work on it again... not hitting McDonalds...
he missed 355 on 3 different occasions.
yesterday he got to sleep in a bit, stopped for his burger, large iced coffee... he smoked 355!
I know not huge numbers in a PL forum but only 5lbs off his PR! just trying to emphasize my point a bit.

[BrotherIron]

Of course you can get arguments why keto diets wouldn't work for strength athletes. I for one would loose all if not most of my strength on a Keto diet. That is just empirical based arugment but there are articles supporting both. Some saying it can be done and others saying it's detrimental to one's performance. There's always going to be 2 sides to the coin.

IMO Keto diet is for aesthetics not for athletics. Big difference. If it was so common place why don't more sprinters, oly weightlifers, shot putters, etc use a Keto Diet? They choose otherwise b/c the demands required for such a sport require Carbs as a steady source to draw upon.

I def agree with you that too many people overlook the importance of fats. Remember how test is created. Cholesterol is the key to high levels of test in the male body. Which is why people who diet and leave out the fats have extremely low sex drive.

[robert da strongman]

all i can say is keto worked for me. lost no strength. i would keep the fats high and get carbs in before training.

[Sistersteel]

Fifty years ago, a high protein diet might have been the way to go considering the thought process during those times was very simple:
Since muscles are made of protein, therefore to develop muscular strength requires a large intake of protein. However, as the understanding of carbohydrate metabolism and sports performance grew, scientists began to realize that this approach was grossly oversimplified. That’s because we now know that the uptake of amino acids into muscle cells is strongly regulated by hormones.

One of the most anabolic hormones in the body is insulin, which is released whenever carbohydrates are eaten. The primary job of insulin is to regulate the amount of glucose in the blood that results from eating carbohydrate, by stimulating cells to take up glucose.

However, this release of insulin also has a potent anabolic effect, helping to drive amino acids into muscle cells, thereby stimulating muscle protein synthesis. In fact, research has demonstrated that feeding protein plus carbohydrate to promote an insulin release results in 50% greater muscle protein synthesis than feeding protein alone.

But carbohydrates also play another valuable role in muscle metabolism – that of helping to conserve hard earned muscle tissue. While a high- protein diet provides plenty of amino acid building blocks to build muscle protein, unless there’s sufficient carbohydrate present to support training (since carbohydrate is the body’s primary source of fuel for exercise), these amino acids are simply used to supplement the fuel supply.

A low/no carbohydrate diet combined with vigorous exercise therefore results in protein oxidation for energy, and since muscles are the major store of amino acids, this can result in muscle tissue loss, especially when training volumes are high.

Another thing, research has clearly demonstrated the importance of ample dietary carbohydrate in reducing the amount of catabolic stress hormones, such as cortisol and adrenaline, which are released during and after exercise and which stimulate the breakdown of muscle tissue. In short, carbohydrate is as much a part of the anabolic equation as protein.


Now let's talk about fats...

Given that both protein and carbohydrate are needed for muscle growth and maintenance, it’s easy to understand how the consensus that high- protein/ample-carbohydrate/low-fat diets are best for strength athletes has arisen. A diet containing moderate or high levels of fat and plenty of protein/carbohydrate would necessarily contain a lot of extra calories, especially as each gram of fat provides 9kcals of energy – double that of carbohydrate or protein. And as we know, an excessive calorie intake leads to gains in body fat – exactly what most athletes don’t want.

Meanwhile, a calorie-controlled moderate/high fat diet would necessarily have to contain relatively little protein and carbohydrate – again not desirable for an athlete seeking to maintain or build strength. Together, these facts explain why protein is king, and why (not withstanding the growing realization of the importance of essential fatty acids) fat is almost seen as a dirty word among strength athletes.

Gaining and retaining muscle tissue certainly requires ample protein and carbohydrate, but that’s not the whole story. After all, if it were, consuming larger and larger quantities of protein would lead to ever increasing strength and muscle size – something that obviously doesn’t happen. This is because hormones also control the metabolism of muscle tissue and protein turnover. Naturally occurring anabolic hormones such as testosterone and HGH act as chemical messengers, directing muscle cells to take up amino acids and synthesize muscle protein. They also stimulate the oxidation of fat for energy, thereby increasing lean muscle mass while decreasing fat mass.

The action of anabolic hormones is balanced by ‘catabolic’ hormones, such as adrenocorticotrophic hormone and cortisol. These hormones are released during ‘fight or flight’ situations, where energy production becomes paramount, and tend to produce a breakdown of body tissue.

Building or maintaining strength requires a hormonal balance that is more anabolic than catabolic. This explains the use of AAS...personally, i think that the only way a keto diet could work for a strength athlete is if they were checmially enhanced. Drugs put the body in a positive nitrogen balance and increase protein synthesis creating the perfect hormonal environment.

Not saying keto has not worked for some.. depending on what their goals might have been or what they arelooking to accomplish though their training....but, in my humble opinion, this approach will hinder gains preventing the athlete from tapping into their full potential.

[toddbz]

I know for me personally through experience I do best (for strength efforts) by having quite a large portion of my daily cals about 2 hours pre workout. Then about 30 minutes prior I'll have aprox 50g in carbs (I love poptarts). I usually get in about 70g protein, 150g or so of CHO (not including the additional 50), and about 40-50g fats. For me personally this easily carries me through my workouts which can tend to be long, and since I'm never hungry after training anyhow allows me to eat a smaller meal and not make me feel like I'm going to burst. It is important to add that I also believe that fiber plays a considerable role in keeping insulin levels from spiking and crashing. I probably take in 10g easy during this PWO meal alone.
I must also add that I'm not trying to really put on any addtitional size either, but keep my weight rather constant to stay with my weight class for PL.

[7_Deadly_Sins]

Of course you can get arguments why keto diets wouldn't work for strength athletes. I for one would loose all if not most of my strength on a Keto diet. That is just empirical based arugment but there are articles supporting both. Some saying it can be done and others saying it's detrimental to one's performance. There's always going to be 2 sides to the coin.

IMO Keto diet is for aesthetics not for athletics. Big difference. If it was so common place why don't more sprinters, oly weightlifers, shot putters, etc use a Keto Diet? They choose otherwise b/c the demands required for such a sport require Carbs as a steady source to draw upon.

I def agree with you that too many people overlook the importance of fats. Remember how test is created. Cholesterol is the key to high levels of test in the male body. Which is why people who diet and leave out the fats have extremely low sex drive.

I want to chime in here from personal experience, and say this is 100% true..I added fats back into my diet and I feel a million times better now(about 1-1.5 months total now) almost like a new person..I don't feel crappy, I have a better attitude, and my sex drive is back where it use to be.

[juggernaut]

I want to chime in here from personal experience, and say this is 100% true..I added fats back into my diet and I feel a million times better now(about 1-1.5 months total now) almost like a new person..I don't feel crappy, I have a better attitude, and my sex drive is back where it use to be.
Not only do I feel fuller when I am higher on fats, but there is a refined difference in strength when increased fats-most likely because of the increased test production.

[7_Deadly_Sins]

Here's a question for everyone then..how do you generally have your diet set up?
I do high protein/moderate carbs/moderate fat.

8-6 or 7 PM I do P/C meals..and after 7-11 I do P/F

I get around 400 G protein a day...carbs...maybe 250..and fat around 50ish..I prob need to up fats more.

[crashcrew56]

What kind of diet does everyone suggest for a powerlifter that it trying to drop some weight?

I'm thinking just sticking to a balanced clean diet, get on an ECA stack, and add cardio

[STRENGTH-TRAINING]

i think it all depends on the current body fat levels, if someones already lean(10-12% bodyfat), they can use carbs more effectively. for someone over 15-20% bodyfat, the keto will allow them to use there own fat stores as energy, while gaining strength, and i heard people with over 15% bodyfat, don't use the insulin spike effectively post workout, becuase it drives more fat storage than muscle growth, everyone is different.

[lilfella]

low carbs= low strength for me.

[BrotherIron]

low carbs= low strength for me.

Same here which is why I cycle my carbs.

[juggernaut]

What kind of diet does everyone suggest for a powerlifter that it trying to drop some weight?

I'm thinking just sticking to a balanced clean diet, get on an ECA stack, and add cardiocc, I'd have to take a look at your calories throughout a week span. www.fitday.com has the best calorie tracker I've ever used, and most of my clients will use it at one time or another to figure out what they need.
That being said, the way I've been taught, if you multiply your bodyweight x 13-15, you'll get a rough idea of where your maintenance calories would be-again this is a rough estimate. Deduct about 10-20% of that (mainly from carbs), and you'll start to lose weight.

[juggernaut]

low carbs= low strength for me.try low carbs, but increase your fats to higher degree. I mean really pound on the steak and swim in the peanut butter. Fat is a sustainable source of efficient energy, plus it increases the test production when utilizing saturated fat.

[juggernaut]

Also, if and when utilizing carbs, try centering it around your post workout meal and possibly breakfast.

[toddbz]

Same here which is why I cycle my carbs.

That whole cyclical carbs thing has real merit. Especially if most are taken in pre and post workout.

[Joshua H]

I dropped from 4000k a day to about 3200k a day now that I transitioned from bodybuilding. I dropped my carbs considerably from 450 to about 300 on workout days. And yes, I center 50% of my carbs around workout as well now. Protein and fats did not drop much, fats took a small drop, protein almost identical all days of the week. Still doing 6 meals a day as before.

My cardio dropped to 3x a week from 4x a week, 45 minutes a session down to 25 minutes, and low intensity to sprints. This also played a factor in my dietary adjustments.

I just found I was getting to soft from the excess carbs and lack of use for them given the change in training and cardio. I feel much better having them lower.

If I go back to hypertrophy based workouts then I am sure to go back to the 400's for carbs, I get crap from low carbs on bodybuilding workouts and splits, absolute crap!

[fatbackgoal]

My prep guy has told me he wants me on 350 p and 200 c daily. Going to work on it this weekend to see how it will all break out. Currently I am sitting at 290 at 20%.

[homegrown]

As of now im doing 60-40 prot. fats.. I honestly go through over 20 lbs of steak a week and eat asparagus for veggies.. I get my fats from the beef and olive oil and or sesame oil, eggs and cheese's.. Lots of lucine and fiber supps.. However on the weekends i eat what ever it is that i want and it reloads all the carbs in my body.. I started doing this because i honestly dont like good carbs.. They dont taste good and they make me feel sick and bloated.. So i did some research and started trying this out and it has made a world of difference. Im stronger and have energy that lasts for days.. The only thing i have noticed is that if i dont eat regularly i start to feel very strange and light headed... But other than that its great...

[bad bad leroy brown]

High protein, moderate fat, and low carb.

Not when training for performance.

[Andrew732]

^^^ yup, more like HIGH carb, high to moderate fat, moderate protein, there should be NO low.

[crashcrew56]

I'm working on playing with my carbs right now to see at what point I can fuel my workouts without turning to sludge

[crashcrew56]

This is just what I follow because it's what works for my performance.


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