Subcutaneous Administration of Testosterone

[maxititer]

I hate of doing IM injections to myself and was very happy to find a good alternative


STABLE TESTOSTERONE LEVELS ACHIEVED
WITH SUBCUTANEOUS TESTOSTERONE
INJECTIONS

M.B. Greenspan, C.M. Chang
Division of Urology, Department of Surgery, McMaster University,
Hamilton, ON, Canada

Objectives: The preferred technique of androgen replacement has been intramuscular (IM) testosterone, but wide variations in testosterone levels are often seen. Subcutaneous
(SC) testosterone injection is a novel approach; however, its physiological effects are unclear.

We therefore investigated the sustainability of stable testosterone levels using
SC therapy.

Patients and methods: Between May and September 2005, we conducted a small pilot study involving 10 male patients with symptomatic late-onset hypogonadism. Every patient had been stable on TE 200 mg IM for 41 year. Patients were instructed to self-inject with
testosterone enanthate (TE) 100 mg SC (DELATESTRYL 200 mg/cc, Theramed Corp, Canada) into the anterior abdomen once weekly. Some patients were down-titrated to 50 mg based on their total testosterone (T) at 4 weeks. Informed consent was obtained as SC testosterone administration is not officially approved by Health Canada. T levels were measured before and 24 hours after injection during weeks 1, 2, 3, and 4, and 96 hours after injection in week 6 and 8. At week 12, PSA, CBC, and T levels were measured however; the week 12 data are still being collected. Results: Prior to initiation of SC therapy, T was 19.14+3.48 nmol/l, hemoglobin 15.8+1.3 g/dl, hematocrit 0.47+0.02, and PSA 1.05+0.65 ng/ml. During the first 4 weeks, there was a steady increase in pre-injection T from 19.14+3.48 to 23.89+9.15 nmol/l (p¼0.1). However, after 8 weeks the post-injection T (25.77+7.67 nmol/l) remained similar to that of week 1 (27.46+12.91 nmol/l).

Patients tolerated this therapy with no adverse effects.

Conclusions: A once-week SC injection of 50–100 mg of TE appears to achieve sustainable and stable levels of physiological T. This technique offers fewer physician visits and the use of smaller quantity of medication, thus lower costs. However, the long term clinical and physiological effects of this therapy need further evaluation.


Saudi Med J. 2006 Dec;27(12):1843-6

Subcutaneous administration of testosterone. A pilot study report.

Al-Futaisi AM, Al-Zakwani IS, Almahrezi AM, Morris D.
Department of Medicine, College of Medicine & Health Sciences, PO Box 35, Postal Code 123, Al-Khod, Sultanate of Oman. Tel. +968 99475401. Tel/Fax. +968 24413419. E-mail: [email protected].

OBJECTIVE: To investigate the effect of low doses of subcutaneous testosterone in hypogonadal men since the intramuscular route, which is the most widely used form of testosterone replacement therapy, is inconvenient to many patients.

METHODS: All men with primary and secondary hypogonadism attending the reproductive endocrine clinic at Royal Victoria Hospital, Monteral, Quebec, Canada, were invited to participate in the study.

Subjects were enrolled from January 2002 till December 2002. Patients were asked to self-administer weekly low doses of testosterone enanthate using 0.5 ml insulin syringe. RESULTS: A total of 22 patients were enrolled in the study. The mean trough was 14.48 +/- 3.14 nmol/L and peak total testosterone was 21.65 +/- 7.32 nmol/L. For the free testosterone the average trough was 59.94 +/- 20.60 pmol/L and the peak was 85.17 +/- 32.88 pmol/L. All of the patients delivered testosterone with ease and no local reactions were reported.

CONCLUSION: Therapy with weekly subcutaneous testosterone produced serum levels that were within the normal range in 100% of patients for both peak and trough levels. This is the first report, which demonstrated the efficacy of delivering weekly testosterone using this cheap, safe, and less painful subcutaneous route.

[marcus300]

With respect, I would rather do my IM injection by the means they are suppose to be done deep intramuscular injection.

[maxititer]

why not, just do it as slow as possible, in most hospitals circulars for nurses, it is 3 minutes per ml for intramuscular injections of oil based drugs.

[THUNDERGOD]

I know a few guys trying this right now. Not much feed back as of yet so I will wait and see how it works for them.

[Johnny Phenomenon]

If it ain't broke....

I think that IM injections are a very small price to pay for muscular bliss.

[Mr. Shoulders]

I sub-q'ed some test suspension one time and had lumps on my abdomen for about 2 weeks...The blood flow just isn't good enough to warrent sub-q injects in my experienced opinion

[maxititer]

I sub-q'ed some test suspension one time and had lumps on my abdomen for about 2 weeks...The blood flow just isn't good enough to warrent sub-q injects in my experienced opinion

that may happens with suspension only, very much possible that your suspension was prepared with PEG, and PEG can be the main reason for inflammation, not suspension itself.

I never heard any such things with esters injected sub c, I'm using that way drostanolon protionate and sustanon for about a year, never had any problems. From reports of others who did same kind of injections, seems like the best would be inject only .5 ml into one point, also slower it is injected - better.

I'm using insulin syringe, but any other kind of syringe with needle suitable for sub c injections also possible.

[drab4]

I've injected subcutaneously a few times, just as a bit of an experiment. I find it slightly less comfortable than the standard intramuscular route, although that could be down to me not being so used to it I guess

[Spauldo]

I just do IM injections. I use 23gauge needle and its 1 inch and a 1/2. I actaul shot it a few weeks ago in my left deltoid. I went all the way in because I thought it was only an 1 inch an 1/4. Then I looked at the back of the needle wrapped and was like FUCK. Anyways I couldnt move my arm for 2 days after that LOL

[MUSCLEMUFFINS TEAM]

Would not risk wasting any, go IM

[badham]

Where this came from has a policy of not having their information leave their site.... don't they Max. it seems rules are not an issue for you.????

And there is over a month of experimentation of this and so far it has been just as effective. I personally prefer IM, but this is an alternative to people who worry scar tissue and what we are hoping to see if the injections have any reduction in adipose fat.....

And credit for this article and the idea behind it should be given to Massive G, Maxititier took and made this sound like he was the driver behind this, he is not, not to mention he broke very special rules where this came from. it is a private board that does not release any of it's posts, everything stays on that board, Max broke that rule and lost his membership over it....

The concept does have merit though to a certain group who have reasons to use it sub Q.

And i do apologize to whoever the board operators are here, I know who the owners aree, but not sure they are active in say to day, but you have a mod who released info that by agreement should have never been released, to me he also tried to make it look like it was his idea, it was none at all to do with him. And I think you need to know , as character is very important, and if he will leak our information here, what would keep him from leaking your info from the mod forum or such places. And if you wish to contact me you can pm me and I will give you the proof that absolutely proves none of what he posted is his research, it isn't, those posts and trials are on out board word for word... and Massive and others have been doing this trial for lack of a better term for over a month... well since 1-13..... Just in the fairness of full disclosure.

And I like Max, but he is selling a bill of goods he does not have, and he should be ashamed.

badham

[esplendido]

that may happens with suspension only, very much possible that your suspension was prepared with PEG, and PEG can be the main reason for inflammation, not suspension itself.

I never heard any such things with esters injected sub c, I'm using that way drostanolon protionate and sustanon for about a year, never had any problems. From reports of others who did same kind of injections, seems like the best would be inject only .5 ml into one point, also slower it is injected - better.

I'm using insulin syringe, but any other kind of syringe with needle suitable for sub c injections also possible.
How the hell do you get an oil based drug to move through those pins? It's slow enough with a 22ga needle!

[maxititer]

Where this came from has a policy of not having their information leave their site.... don't they Max. it seems rules are not an issue for you.????

And there is over a month of experimentation of this and so far it has been just as effective. I personally prefer IM, but this is an alternative to people who worry scar tissue and what we are hoping to see if the injections have any reduction in adipose fat.....

And credit for this article and the idea behind it should be given to Massive G, Maxititier took and made this sound like he was the driver behind this, he is not, not to mention he broke very special rules where this came from. it is a private board that does not release any of it's posts, everything stays on that board, Max broke that rule and lost his membership over it....

The concept does have merit though to a certain group who have reasons to use it sub Q.

And i do apologize to whoever the board operators are here, I know who the owners aree, but not sure they are active in say to day, but you have a mod who released info that by agreement should have never been released, to me he also tried to make it look like it was his idea, it was none at all to do with him. And I think you need to know , as character is very important, and if he will leak our information here, what would keep him from leaking your info from the mod forum or such places. And if you wish to contact me you can pm me and I will give you the proof that absolutely proves none of what he posted is his research, it isn't, those posts and trials are on out board word for word... and Massive and others have been doing this trial for lack of a better term for over a month... well since 1-13..... Just in the fairness of full disclosure.

And I like Max, but he is selling a bill of goods he does not have, and he should be ashamed.

badham

it comes from bolex actually, there was a thread started by Zero Tolerance in 2007. I just paid more attention to it then others. I'm using it myself for more then a years and few other friends too. Impression is that it is good alternative to im injection. Nothing to be a shame of.

[maxititer]

How the hell do you get an oil based drug to move through those pins? It's slow enough with a 22ga needle!

It may depend on oil too, some oils are very thin, but almost any oil will go through insulin syringe.

[badham]

it comes from bolex actually, there was a thread started by Zero Tolerance in 2007. I just paid more attention to it then others. I'm using it myself for more then a years and few other friends too. Impression is that it is good alternative to im injection. Nothing to be a shame of.


Sure.. give me the link than...... that will take care of it..... cause I just did a search of bolex and there is not post wit that and you know it Max.... lying now just makes it worse.... but maybe you can use the bolex search function better than me... so please... jsut a link that has the exact info as the thread opend 1-13 on the private board mentioned and I also can prove you copied it from there and you know it, you know we lof ever cut and past if it is repasted on out board... but please... that would be a great oplace to start clearing your name.


Ofcourse it would make perfect sense you neve made mention in the threa that this was psotede on bpo;ex nack in 2007 in 11 posts in that thread. noty once.... isn't that just a bit odd.


badham

[maxititer]

sure here it is
http://www.anabolex.com/forums/showthread.php?t=12722

[badham]

That is nt the same post and though it addresses sub Q oil injection, you can nto jup around it that easy max... Watch several open boards... the facts will show up there in the next week with a complete chronology...


If this had been the case.. you would have responed... you can try to cover your ass, but you can not hide the fact that you took an issue and misled the people here, and you are lying about why and wher eyou got that from, and "I can prove it... and I will.


But not here.... this board has nothing to do with this, and it should not be pulled in the middle of your misdeeds, and I will not pull it in the middle of them. But be looking over you shoulder, cause the truth is coming.

Good luck to you..... I hope this was worth it to you.


badham

[RazorRipped]

That is nt the same post and though it addresses sub Q oil injection, you can nto jup around it that easy max... Watch several open boards... the facts will show up there in the next week with a complete chronology...


If this had been the case.. you would have responed... you can try to cover your ass, but you can not hide the fact that you took an issue and misled the people here, and you are lying about why and wher eyou got that from, and "I can prove it... and I will.


But not here.... this board has nothing to do with this, and it should not be pulled in the middle of your misdeeds, and I will not pull it in the middle of them. But be looking over you shoulder, cause the truth is coming.

Good luck to you..... I hope this was worth it to you.


badham

I've read this thread. I never once saw Max say this was his protocol. He posted this to stir conversation

Secondly, anabolix isn't a private board. So WTF are you talking about?

Lastly, if you have some beef with Max, take it elsewhere. Comprehende?

BTW, try spell check when you want to argue with someone. You look like an idiot!

[RazorRipped]

Maxititer, way to handle yourself with class and dignity. Leave the dirty work to Razor. LOL. :)

FUCK YEAhttp://www.intensemuscle.com/images/smilies/punch.gif

[badham]

Razor, I cannot really fairly answer you, because I own a very effective private board, and we have very strict rules on information leaving the board, and even I as the owner do not let info from the board.

So you are trying to read between the lines and assume you know what you are talking about... but in this case you are wrong, this very subject, including the posted trial info was started on this private board on 1-13-2009 and this boar is a collaboration of some of the better thought of guys around the boards. Max knows exactly what he did, and he knows exactly how he violated our rules and how he has misrepresented what he did. Now I am not doing to dirty your board with this issue. This has nothing to do with rxmuscle... we gave, or I gave Max every chance in the world today to answer why he cut and pasted info from our board which is strictly against out rules, even if the info can be found other places... he should have for it there... it took him until tonight to concoct a story because he knows we have very extensive security software, and one of the functions of the software we run allows us to track members who copy any text from our board, it zero's it back out if the info is then posted somewhere within the server we own, or in this case just this site. Well the info was never releases, which means it was copied and never pasted on out board...... now for open boards this would be no big deal, and we do not ask for members, people are referred to us and we have a very strong set of members, they are very advanced in both the science and real life application of all parts of AAS, MMA, bodybuilding and powelifting... but the board is built around complete security for our members and that is why we cannot have a member like Max violating the rules, and he did, it is easily proved.

But as I said I do not think this board is the places to deal with this...l have no issue with this board, and I have no issue with Max other than he lied and broke rules he agreed to uphold... I would have not know it showed up here had I not seen a post exactly like was running at our site except ours has been running for over a month and we are making a study out of it.....that I not important. but do not make a fool out of yourself assuming you understand this situation, =because given your statements you do not.... so while this is your house and you can do what you want as far as banning me or running me off, that is what most weak people who have no clue what they are talking about do when they stick their foot in their mouth and then don't like the taste of it... I will not be active here anyway, because I like to be places where the truth is important... and you have at least one mod that it is not so.

But you are way off base, if you want to know the real story, be glad to fill you in, with facts, I make no allegation unless I can prove it... and I absolutely can. Otherwise, you just need to back up as you are out of you league on the facts on this deal.....

You will find out in time exactly what you have.... but that is your choice also... I would not let you tell me how to run my board, I am not telling you how to run yours....


But Maxititier is a lair and he did mislead and post information he took a pledge not to do... you can accept that ot not... you are not who I will be directing my convincing too... but to have have a great board you have to be able to attract strong, smart, and honest people, because that is what members are lookingfor. I hope in the long run that is what you get... but that is not what he has done in his short time at our place. I will take responsibility for that. I let in a person who did not belong on our board...... and that is my fault.....


And lastly, I would rather look like an idiot than be one........which is what you will turn out looking like. Once again if you knew the reason for the typos you would look about as dumb as a box of rocks... but as with so many of these open boards, you are just a punk kid who is real tough behind a computer screen..... and would fold like a child in person....save all the tough talk for someone who you can intimidate... you are not in my league.... pretending to be so would just look even more ignorant on your part... even with my typos....

[RazorRipped]

And lastly, I would rather look like an idiot than be one........which is what you will turn out looking like. Once again if you knew the reason for the typos you would look about as dumb as a box of rocks... but as with so many of these open boards, you are just a punk kid who is real tough behind a computer screen..... and would fold like a child in person....save all the tough talk for someone who you can intimidate... you are not in my league.... pretending to be so would just look even more ignorant on your part... even with my typos....

Max posted a link to where those studies were. I see no copyright amendment to those studies.
If YOUR board doesn't have a legal amendment, guess what? Max can do as he pleases?

Secondly, I'm no kid at all. Maybe before YOU put your foot in your big mouth, you should do your homework.:)

Not in your league? And what league might that be?:)

Tough talk? Where did I threaten you?

Feeling ok? You seem very angry, or better yet, bitter.

What's your excuse for your poor grammar? You seem to be able to type. Why not use spell check to make yourself look literate?

[militantmuscle]

I am not trying to stir things up here, but the information Maxititer presented was an independent study by the Division of Urology, Department of Surgery at McMaster University... so if that information was made public why can't he discuss subcutaneous injections?

[RazorRipped]

I am not trying to stir things up here, but the information Maxititer presented was an independent study by the Division of Urology, Department of Surgery at McMaster University... so if that information was made public why can't he discuss subcutaneous injections?


According to this guy, even if it's public info, if it was posted on his board,and you have ELITE privilege to be part of his ELITE community, you can't repost ANYTHING that was posted on his board.
It's like CNN posting info on their site, but if someone is a member of this guys ELITE site,and that info was posted there, you are forbidden to post that info anywhere else.

Here's what I think of that..http://forums.musculardevelopment.com/images/smilies4/pileofsteamingshit01.gif

[militantmuscle]

Sounds like censorship.

[DOIT]

ouch!!

[marcus300]

This thread is funny and reminds me of old times, but pls forget Sub-Q and go with IM for god sake its not worth arguing about:p