Training frequency

[Mr. Hyde]

Anyone train bodyparts more then once a week. Its kind of a taboo topic so i was hoping everyone would drop by and put in there 2 cents. I was hitting bodyparts 2x a week for 4-6 weeks with great results, i just wanted to test the waters.
Its known that protein synthesis is only elevated in a muscle for 48 to at the most 72 hours after it has been trained. Some people believe that if your not training a muscle again after this it is just time wasted from growth. (ex Coleman)
Other people believe that it takes around a week for recovery and super compensating to take place, meaning even though the muscle recovered with in 48-72 hours it hasn't grown to its max potential. (ex Yates)
Now, this is a topic that has always troubled me from the day i started traing. I feel that it depends on your gentics and recovery.

Coleman = training muscles 2x a week, Moderate volume = HUGENESS

Yates = training muscles 1x per week, Low Volume = HUGENESS

I am aware they are both drug users but never the less 2 totaly different styles of training, 2 gigantic dudes. :confused:

[Bennny]

I am a true believer of the Instinctive Training Principle. If I feel like training a bodypart after only 3 days rest, I do it. If it's been 5 days since a certain bodypart has been trained and it just doesn't feel right, I'll wait another day. I've been trying to adhere to a 4 days on, 1 day off program lately. So far so good.

[KEVDIESEL]

i am a true believer of the instinctive training principle. If i feel like training a bodypart after only 3 days rest, i do it. If it's been 5 days since a certain bodypart has been trained and it just doesn't feel right, i'll wait another day. I've been trying to adhere to a 4 days on, 1 day off program lately. So far so good.i agree, go with your instinct and definately try different routines, 1x per week, 2x per week find your nich and see what seems to be getting the job done for your physique. One man's golden routine may suck for you and one's bad routine may do you wonders.

[Larry C]

I used to train every muscle twice a week and had slight gains, lots of vascularity in my arms even though I was lighter. Didn't seem to make major gains with the twice a week routine so recently brought it back to once and have seen improvements.

[BrandonBass]

I believe in training everything 1x per week with maximum intensity/low volume. As naturals, recovery is even more important since we aren't taking drugs that speed up the process....just my 2 cents

[Mr. Hyde]

At the moment i am training everything once a week over 4 days. Sometimes i run a 3 day split over a M-W-F-S roution hitting everything every 4-5 day. I also do Powerlifting / Bodybuilding routine. M-T power, T-F-S bodybuilding. Layne Norton does something like this.

Its a Catch 22 with me, hitting everything 2x a week improved my chest alot but i mentally was never able to destroy my legs because they would still be sore by the next work out. I will say i have been on a keto diet for the past 3 weeks while hitting every muscle 1x a week and last week i broke my leg press pr, i went from 1015 for 8 too 1040 for 10 (i also could walk for about 5 days).

Im wondering with carbs and extra calories in my diet what i can do this Fall/winter as PR's go. I also got my deadlift back up to where it was since a herniated disc injury last spring. I cant free squat no more but i always had better results with smith squats and leg press anyway so i try not to let it bother me to much. Telling a bodybuilder they cant squat any more is like banning a fat kid from candy forever!! I comptemplated suicide for a little bit but then i got over it. lol

I think the verdict is im going to stick with once a week and add as many intensity tactics to my chest workout as possible.

[Wheels]

I use a 4 day split and train every body part once over 8 days; allowing one rest day after every training day. This has worked really well for me. When I train I like to destroy the muscle and if I were to train with any more frequency I don't think my body would recover as efficiently.

[tiramisu]

3x per week full body - wichita falls - advance novice strength program.
I will likely progress to texas method intermediate program by winter.

squats, deads, powercleans, military press, bench, chins

I'm no where near strong enough to spend my day doing biceps curls.

[Koubs]

Mr. Hyde, why don't you train your chest twice per week, and do your legs once per week?? You don't NEED to train EVERYTHING 2X per week... If you were seeing improvements, stick with what works until it doesn't work anymore...

Personally, I like and use the 1X per week for all bodyparts... It's worked well, I like the lower volume/high intensity training... But if you want to bring up your chest, I think training it 2X per week for a period of time could definitely work...



Its a Catch 22 with me, hitting everything 2x a week improved my chest alot but i mentally was never able to destroy my legs because they would still be sore by the next work out.

[TheSpirit]

Overall volume for bodyparts per week is more important. Some bodyparts recover faster than others. Also the "heavier" weights you push can make stress the CNS harder therefore make recovery take longer. Learn your bodys recover and attack it when it has healed. No need waiting 7 days between bodyparts when you could hit it again in 3-4 days.

Look up Dual factor Hypertrophy Theory.

[Mr. Hyde]

Mr. Hyde, why don't you train your chest twice per week, and do your legs once per week?? You don't NEED to train EVERYTHING 2X per week... If you were seeing improvements, stick with what works until it doesn't work anymore...

Personally, I like and use the 1X per week for all bodyparts... It's worked well, I like the lower volume/high intensity training... But if you want to bring up your chest, I think training it 2X per week for a period of time could definitely work...

I was thinking about only hitting chest twice a week. I decided to go back to 1x a week, keep a solid log book and try to progress on all my lifts, if i dont see any improvements im gonna go back to 2x a week with chest.

[TheSpirit]

I was thinking about only hitting chest twice a week. I decided to go back to 1x a week, keep a solid log book and try to progress on all my lifts, if i dont see any improvements im gonna go back to 2x a week with chest.
Impatient much?

[Mr. Hyde]

How do you figure? I didnt even give a time frame. I could have ment 10 years for all you know.


Impatient much?

[Military Might]

well i really believe it depends on how intense you truely are working out! Basically if you're hitting any body part 2x a week you're probably not going all out or else you won't possibly be able recover in time. I like to refer to old Arthur Jones and Mike Mentzer style High Intensity Training. The results A Jones was able to instill into all his trainees was amazing but he usually had them work out only 4x in two-three weeks.

But again if you're hitting 2x a week you're probably not getting the intensity, you'd have better results is you gave more recovery time and more out right hard work during your workouts. And we all know you don't grow in the gym you grow when you're recovering soooo just think about that.

[Mr. Hyde]

I started this thread for imformation purposes, i just wanted everyone to post there ideas. I train 4 day a week hitting every muscle 1x Dorian style. I use alot of rest-pause and train to failure. The higher frequency routines i ran for a couple of months just to try them out and had pretty good results. Natural pro Layne Norton hits every muscle 2x a week with high volume, he his pic posted some where of the leg devlopment before he started hitting them 2x a week and around a year later and his results where amazing. Im not saying this is the ideal way to train, i always keep a open mind because everybody is different. I feel as long as you are gaining size and/or getting stronger what ever your doing is working, when you hit a wall experment with new things. So i am not advocating 2x a week, 1x a week, HIT, volume, DC and what ever other programs are out there, im just trying to keep an open mind.

[Military Might]

Well it's true we all respond differently but i have a feeling that Layne Nortn\on probably wasn't working as intensely as he could have if he was doing 1x a week legs then makes results off of 2x a week it's clear he wasn't stimulating growth by not executing out right hard work. And in the case when you actually are preforming out right hard work during your routines and you don't see any results rest longer between workouts. Arthur Jones used to preach that beginners could work with more frequency and when they became more advanced they'd have to work out less because they'd over train.

[jjjohns_10]

The all around general consensus is to train each body part with maximum intensity 1 time per week. But as others have said, go with your gut. Not to many guys can train each body part 2 times per week and grow. Ronnie Coleman is an exception, but he is also a PRO! Dorian Yates swears by training each body part 1 time per week and he is someone almost all of us would aspire to be. Every bodybuilder is different.

Don't get out in the weeds, try different things, be intense, and listen to what the mirror tells you; IT NEVER LIES!!!! hahaha

[Mr. Hyde]

Arthur Jones used a fullbody routine 3x a week and for adavanced trainies 2x a week. Arthur Jones was to first person to start HIT but i have never heard of one person using the routines he laid out in the 70's. Metzner had good ideas but he went a little crazy towards the end. Dorian Yates had the biggest impact with his version of HIT.

I do not disgree with anybody. 1x a week might be great for some but 2x a week work great for some also. Plus, there has never been on study that has proved a muscle takes longer the 72-94 to fully recover. I feel its better to undertrain then overtrain but unless you deadlifting a bus or something 168 hours of recovery time is MORE then enough.

FYI Layne deadlifts and squats 600+ pounds, you tube him, hes a freak and hes a natty.

[Mr. Hyde]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GTgLtVBgJQ4

[Northman]

2 times a week on diet

1 time a week on bulk

[meatheadio]

As natural trainers we are more succeptable to overtraining. For this reason I recommend training each body part over 12 days, using a four day split, Ideally this would be done in a two on one off style. This is a higher frquency style so the volume must be low-moderate but the intensity moderate to high. I personally find that the lower the volume the better my gains. For example today I trained back and did 2 warm up sets then 1 work set of DB rows, 2 work sets of pulldowns, 1 work set of cable rows supersetted with 1 work set of pullovers. That's it, only 5 work sets total. This is low volume style, as I have found with my clients that one of the main reasons (besides inadequte nutrition) they dont make gains is being grosely overtrained all the time.
The idea is to do a low number of sets,but still have a variety of exercises. This style allows you to stimulate the muscle more often but does not fry the CNS with huge amounts of sets and exercises.
Works well for me and everyone I work with.

[Ninja Loco]

Once every 7 days.

[LittleBIG]

As natural trainers we are more succeptable to overtraining. For this reason I recommend training each body part over 12 days, using a four day split, Ideally this would be done in a two on one off style. This is a higher frquency style so the volume must be low-moderate but the intensity moderate to high. I personally find that the lower the volume the better my gains. For example today I trained back and did 2 warm up sets then 1 work set of DB rows, 2 work sets of pulldowns, 1 work set of cable rows supersetted with 1 work set of pullovers. That's it, only 5 work sets total. This is low volume style, as I have found with my clients that one of the main reasons (besides inadequte nutrition) they dont make gains is being grosely overtrained all the time.
The idea is to do a low number of sets,but still have a variety of exercises. This style allows you to stimulate the muscle more often but does not fry the CNS with huge amounts of sets and exercises.
Works well for me and everyone I work with.

Absolutely right! Overtraining and poor nutrition are the biggest problem for a natural bodybuilder. Even of you get your nutrition straight you still need more time to recover than a bodybuilder on roids. That is a fact and this is the reason why most of the naturals can't use the training schedules of pros the exact same way.
About the feeling - the way I see it, when you go by the feeling the main thing is nutrition. If you consume alot of calories than you recover much faster and you feel ready to train sooner than normal. If you are cutting down than the time to regain your enegry will be longer.
Personally I always go by the feeling, one week I go heavy and if the next week I don't feel quite that strong, I go lighter ... Or I do lower volume ... But all of it has to do with the nutrition ...

[novorossiya]

A good way to see if you're making progress from workout to workout is measuring your results against your last workout and seeing if you have improved anything, ie. increased weight or reps. Some people have better genetics and so might be able to recover faster but i think this is a measurable way to figure out your training frequency.

And yeh, i reckon nutrition is about 90% of the battle. If you're not making the gains you want, i would like at your diet before your training, regardless of your goals.

Good thread!!

[Mr. Hyde]

This is cool. Everyone put alot of good ideas in this thread.

[LittleBIG]

A good way to see if you're making progress from workout to workout is measuring your results against your last workout and seeing if you have improved anything, ie. increased weight or reps. Some people have better genetics and so might be able to recover faster but i think this is a measurable way to figure out your training frequency.

And yeh, i reckon nutrition is about 90% of the battle. If you're not making the gains you want, i would like at your diet before your training, regardless of your goals.

Good thread!!

It is very difficult to observe the gains from one workout to antother - after all there are alot of factors involved - the food you ate, the sleep you got, how many coffees you had, did you took time off from the gym, are you stressed ...
My opinion is to take a longer period and set a goal - let's say 3 months from now I want to bench 20 kg more. And you work for it - if after 1.5 months you can't bench 10 kgs more, you must do some adjustments ... Same thing goes for cutting down, for building mass, for doing jogging ...

[Will the Thrill]

I like training with lots of volume but honestly I think that it's the best for me. I started doing Eric Broser's P/RR/S routine and I like it. There's nice variety and having a little more strict program written by someone else really helps because I would most likely do more sets than is really necessary.

So I've been training 4 days a week for about a year and like the results I'm getting. Plus knowing that I'm going to be doing 8 sets instead of 16 for a major bodypart really has helped me ramp up the intensity of my workouts.

I am hitting my chest a second time later in the week for a period of time since it's a weak point for me with about half the volume of a regular workout as Eric suggests.

[BrianNassar]

For myself it depends on my environmental stressors - family, work, diet, etc.
After a tough week at work there is no way that I can train as frequent than when I have a few days off from work.
I believe people get to caught up in "programs" than actually utilizing hard, intense, focused training.
While I was in FL working 50+ hours a week and traveling for VPX, I only was training 2 times per week (total body) and making the best gains in my life while getting leaner.

[thepump]

depends on how hard my intesity is and what gear i'm on. most of which all of you have mentioned above already