What happened?

[bigmikecox]

What has caused women's bbing to go from being on Wide World of Sports to having only 2 pro contests in 2009? Why are there no $$$ for this sport? Iris Kyle is coming in on passing Lenda Murray in Olympia wins, yet she gets ZERO coverage. You used to be able to see tons of articles on women's bbing in Flex and Muscle and Fitness, now, you'll be lucky to see a pic of a women bber in a magazine.

[Tatyana]

Anabolic Steroids

[esplendido]

They don't look like Rachel McLiscious anymore. Of course, she'd have a hard time winning the bikini division today.

[tammyp]

sad and frustrating to say the least.

[Allifit]

There's a million and one reasons...and they'll vary depending on whom you ask. It's disheartening, to me at least, as I've always been a fan of female bodybuilders, and even though I compete in figure I draw on my inspiration from a lot of female bodybuilders, and have since I began lifting.

I am the cohost for siouxcountrys late night radio show, sports after dark and Eryn (the host) and myself interviewed Brian Moss a while back and part of our topic discussion veered towards women's bbing, the changes it's made over the last two decades...and where its going. He had some great insight....

I'm in NO WAY SHAPE OR FORM trying to tread toes here by linking this and if mods feel the need to pull it down I understand but this is the link to the broadcast:



and his is about halfways down the page "Interview with Brian Moss" and click play now.

And as I said...this is sad to me. I adore fbbing and have alot of friends who are female bbers. I hope this sport continues to grow and not be contained the way it appears to be now...

[Allifit]

sad and frustrating to say the least.
So off topic but SLAMMIN' avatar Tammy... looking dead sexy!

[lil mama]

Hey Alli any help getting the word out is great, and Thank u for supporting us FBB's. We need to keep it going and putting the word out if anything so that it can survive and help our future pro's to have a place to shine and illustrate all thier hard work.

[pillowtalk]

and also lets not forget that most mens bb cov is viewed and bought by male homos...just keepin it real.

[Curt James]

and also lets not forget that most mens bb cov is viewed and bought by male homos...just keepin it real.

How is that relevant?

Is most of the female side viewed and bought by female homosexuals? (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lesbian)

re The Wide World of Sports, many believe Arnold botched that with his Olympia "win" in 1980. :( And, of course, the steroid witch hunt hasn't helped at all.


They don't look like Rachel McLiscious anymore. Of course, she'd have a hard time winning the bikini division today.

Truth.

Unfortunately, the look of today's Pro fbb is just not marketable on a large scale.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v108/curt_james/Rx/anja_langer.jpg
She was.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v108/curt_james/Rx/iris_kyle.jpg

She, apparently, is not. :(

Iris did appear on ABC's Wipe Out and I thought I heard she was invited back. But with only one cover (September 1998 issue of NPC News), it doesn't look like she's getting much love. :(

[AVBG]

In my opinion, what happened was deliberate. With the advent of the fitness/figure/bikini divisions the options for participating trainers/competitors were increased dramatically and the earning potential from competitions was subsequently watered down.

[Allifit]

Unfortunately, the look of today's Pro fbb is just not marketable on a large scale.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v108/curt_james/Rx/anja_langer.jpg
She was.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v108/curt_james/Rx/iris_kyle.jpg

She, apparently, is not. :(


Marketability should not be the only factor in determining whether or not athletes are entitled to have a venue to compete at.

Everything evolves. And that includes athetes, and female bodybuilders. Just as male bodybuilding has changed and evolved, so has female bodybuilding. The comparison above can be paralleled to the look of Arnold:
http://www.ifbb.com/halloffame/1999/ArnoldSchwarzenegger2.jpg

compared to the look of someone like Ronnie Coleman...
http://www.thenextarnold.com/images/photos/ronniecoleman2_lrg.jpg

Both are IFBB Pros. Both are Olympians. Both have dominated their sport respectively. Both are bodybuilders. Yet since their competitive careers are decades apart its easy to see the differences in their physiques and the EVOLUTION male bodybuilding has undergone.

WHY... WHY ... WHY... is it that despite male bodybuilding's evolution away from a "mainstream" look over the years has not caused it to suffer at the hands of sponsors and promoters, while female bodybuilding has? Neither the Ronnie Coleman, nor the Iris Kyle look is marketable to the mainstream public. Despite what people may say I know PLENTY of women repulsed by the extreme male bber just as some men are repulsed by the extreme female bber. Yet male bodybuilding is still flourishing.....

makes little to no sense to me...

[GirlyMuscle]

Very good points, Alli. Unfortunately, I think it's because regardless of what anyone says women are and always will be viewed as sex symbols. If we aren't "fuckable" we aren't worthy.

[Allifit]

Very good points, Alli. Unfortunately, I think it's because regardless of what anyone says women are and always will be viewed as sex symbols. If we aren't "fuckable" we aren't worthy.

Perhaps... it's a shame if thats the only way our marketability can be defined.

I know PLENTY of women who think male bbers aren't "fuckable" either. IF women are marketed on their sexual appeal then how are male bbers marketed? Usually somewhere along the same lines- that if you take this supplement you'll get huge and get mass amounts of chicks like Jay Cutler or whichever pro happens to be in the supp ad...

but my point is thats techncially not true as the extreme male bber look is pretty much just as unpopular as the extreme female bber look...

[Curt James]

Marketability should not be the only factor in determining whether or not athletes are entitled to have a venue to compete at.
Everything evolves. And that includes athetes, and female bodybuilders.
(snip)
WHY... WHY ... WHY... is it that despite male bodybuilding's evolution away from a "mainstream" look over the years has not caused it to suffer at the hands of sponsors and promoters, while female bodybuilding has?
(snip)
makes little to no sense to me...


Very good points, Alli. Unfortunately, I think it's because regardless of what anyone says women are and always will be viewed as sex symbols.(snip)

I'd like to read what everyone sees as the perfect situation for female bodybuilding.

One limitation, imo, is the industry itself. Another is the steroid witch hunt.

The industry because athletes are unable to seek out moneymaking alternatives from the sport. Lee Priest signed on with PDI and then found that organization in the dumper and himself banned from the IFBB.

And steroids because they're no longer legal and that fact has obviously added a stigma to the sport that has, I'm guessing, discouraged many sponsors.

I don't see any bodybuilder, male or female, on a box of Wheaties any time soon.

Ownership of the athletes by individual organizations and steroid stigma aside, the answer to why must be money. Men flourish because the money is flowing while women are languishing because the money has dried up or been rerouted.

Instead of why, ask where.

Where's the money going?

[machine]

It all comes down to money, you have plenty of guy willing to buy a magazine that ronnie coleman is on. There are tons of people out there that love the look of fbb and the more muscular figure girls...they just need to something other than look at the girls pictures online, GET OUT THERE AND START SUPPORTING THESE ATHLETES!

[Curt James]

the extreme male bber look is pretty much just as unpopular as the extreme female bber look...

That message has obviously not reached someone.

Unsolicited book, anyone? :rolleyes:

It would be great if muscle was viewed as entertainment more than sport. The competition factor really limits things in many ways. I'm not as interested in who wins the trophies as much as simply appreciating the condition or shape the athlete has achieved.

The competition system is not set up for exhibition or simple display. What if no judges and no sanction fees were involved?

Lighting would be necessary and the auditorium to be rented, sound system, an emcee, but skip the judging entirely.

What's the alternative for female physique display?

Just listened to that interview with Awefilms. Seems like the IFBB is onboard with their site as they mention that organization on their pages repeatedly.

That can't be right so far as copyright goes. The NFL would never allow their name to be used like that. What that says to me is that the IFBB is overlooking the fact that many of its athletes are making money from Awefilms and other outlets and aren't objecting to "IFBB Pro" being mentioned on those sites.

Why?

Because the women have a certain amount of power. Unused power.

Imagine if all the women walked off. There will never be that type of unity, unfortunately. But, yeah, that would be a difficult spot for the IFBB and sponsors alike. Or maybe not.

What would happen if female bodybuilding, fitness, figure, and the new bikini platform simply didn't exist? Maybe the NPC and IFBB wouldn't blink.

Who would lose money if the men chose to pursue work in some other field? Kai Greene, strength and conditioning specialist; Toney Freeman, restaurateur; Jay Cutler, insurance salesman; Gustavo Badell, interpreter; Victor Martinez, illustrator; and the others all find another career.

Dexter Jackson named Mr. Olympia for the second year.

On an empty stage.

Think that someone would change the way the money is distributed? I thought I read a question in one of these threads about where the sanction fees go. Who gets that fee paid for the cute organization membership cards?


It all comes down to money, you have plenty of guy willing to buy a magazine that ronnie coleman is on. There are tons of people out there that love the look of fbb and the more muscular figure girls...they just need to something other than look at the girls pictures online, GET OUT THERE AND START SUPPORTING THESE ATHLETES!

Truth.

I'm listening to Kevin Trudeau's one book on CD. He annoys the f*** out of me with his repeated statement, "It's always all about the money!"

But, yeah, I'm guessing that it's always all about the money.

I don't have any answers, but share the frustration that more people don't appreciate physique. The world will never be populated entirely by Olympia caliber physiques, but all people could benefit from a healthy bodybuilding lifestyle.

One thing I definitely dislike is the 20% softer rule or whatever that flip-flopping standard happens to be. Each woman should be encouraged to reach their personal best appearance regardless of some organization's concept of what looks right. And, yes, there should be a venue for all women in which to display that personal best.

I'm not sure that platform is best represented in the form of physique competition.

[fitmomma3]

People need to stop using the word mainstream synonymous with bodybuilding the two will never go hand in hand and were not ever meant to. Even in the days when BB received more media coverage it was by no means "mainstream". But with that said marketability, popularity, and support in it's own industry is lacking for FBB.

To get to the route of the problem you have to start with the base... which to me is the number of competitors actually competing, it has a trickling effect. If we cannot convince enough people to compete in the sport how can we convince people to support it? More competitors entered equals more ticket sales more entry fees more fans/support and that will provide more sponsorship opportunities, more money, and more respect as the sport will thrive.

So we have to ask the question why are less and less women competing in FBB each year? Locally the numbers are dismal and the reason that keeps popping up is that a majority of competitors do not want to do what in necessary to reach top level in this sport whether it be much added weight, increase or addition of AAS, or extreme low body fat levels. They do not want to risk their health or their femininity for it, or they do not even want to LOOK like the desired look.

Changing the standard of the look, may be the only way to get more competitors. People will then go on to protest the 20% less muscle rule or the idea of bringing back a more classic look for BB but this may be just what helps the sport...
Dexter Jackson winning the Olympia, the addition of the 202 and under class, and even the addition of bikini may all be signs that a more classic look is where this sport is headed. But in any case whatever is decided to be the standard, they need to find it, define it clearly, and stick with it! CONSTANT inconsistencies devalue the judging and is another reason IMO for lack of participation.

[Allifit]

People need to stop using the word mainstream synonymous with bodybuilding the two will never go hand in hand and were not ever meant to. Even in the days when BB received more media coverage it was by no means "mainstream". But with that said marketability, popularity, and support in it's own industry is lacking for FBB.

To get to the route of the problem you have to start with the base... which to me is the number of competitors actually competing, it has a trickling effect. If we cannot convince enough people to compete in the sport how can we convince people to support it? More competitors entered equals more ticket sales more entry fees more fans/support and that will provide more sponsorship opportunities, more money, and more respect as the sport will thrive.

So we have to ask the question why are less and less women competing in FBB each year? Locally the numbers are dismal and the reason that keeps popping up is that a majority of competitors do not want to do what in necessary to reach top level in this sport whether it be much added weight, increase or addition of AAS, or extreme low body fat levels. They do not want to risk their health or their femininity for it, or they do not even want to LOOK like the desired look.

Changing the standard of the look, may be the only way to get more competitors. People will then go on to protest the 20% less muscle rule or the idea of bringing back a more classic look for BB but this may be just what helps the sport...
Dexter Jackson winning the Olympia, the addition of the 202 and under class, and even the addition of bikini may all be signs that a more classic look is where this sport is headed. But in any case whatever is decided to be the standard, they need to find it, define it clearly, and stick with it! CONSTANT inconsistencies devalue the judging and is another reason IMO for lack of participation.

REALLY well said lady..... REALLY!:bowdown:

[Skeptic]

I'm with Sassy et al. on this one. Sadly, lamentably, embarrassingly, it all comes down to fuckability.

Men buy Muscle and Fitness, women buy Oxygen. Sigh.

And what Alli says aboot male BBers rings true in my personal experience. The women I know would rather bang Jason Statham than Ronnie Coleman any day.

Slightly OT but related: I have always viewed BBing as an extreme activity with virtually no hope of mainstream popularity. I see BBing as a sort of "lab" for just how muscular a human body can get. The same way that archery is a lab for just how relaxed and consistent a human can be with this ancient piece of machinery. And neither one has much mass appeal.

[Angela123]

[QUOTE=Skeptic;146839] women buy Oxygen. QUOTE]

it stinks tho for the women who are into serious weight lifting and bb lifestyle...bc oxygen isnt that helpful or interesting to those ladies. i guess its good bathroom reading. i wont buy it tho. it doesnt have any groundbreaking tips, advice or articles about serious bb diets and mass building training. and they mostly use models who look like bikini models or a typical fitness model. they used to use more figure and fitness competitors..they dont use as many as they used to. it was much better back in the late 90s. i still have an issue from 1998..it is crazy how different it was lol. even early 2000s were better...but now even women's bb and fitness mags are not even for 'us.' us meaning the competitive female weightlifter. we just have to realize that as fitmomma and skeptic say, fbb will never be mainstream. but it still stinks that even in our small world of bb, it is dissappearing.

goodness i hope no more pro shows r taken away after this year. it is scary.

[debbiebramwell]

Hey everyone! first of all I wanted to say I am very hopeful about things being done about the future of our sport....stay tune for a show being brought back this year for fbbrs...also, I have had personal conversations with someone who wants to sponser a few shows next year and give us alot of coverage and special attention...I will be reaching out to all fbbrs to get involved and stick together with all this...
Secondly, I am gonna be 43 years old which means I have been on the dating scene for 27 years!! I have never been asked out, approached, complimented more in my life! when I was on a dating site I got slammed, at myspace, my personal email, on the streets etc( I guess I am more fuckable looking then ever! hahaha):D Lets stay positive , get involved and show support to fbbr!:beerbang:

[debbiebramwell]

it has just been announced tampa pro show for women is back!! we did it!!! and the prize money is higher!!!!! this is great news!!!!!:beerbang:

[Skeptic]

it has just been announced tampa pro show for women is back!! we did it!!! and the prize money is higher!!!!! this is great news!!!!!:beerbang:

And I understand you were instrumental in making it happen. Kudos! :bowdown:

[Angela123]

omg, that is fantastic news! can u give us details how all of this happened? who all were involved in getting the show back?

when is it again?

[Ibarramedia]

omg, that is fantastic news! can u give us details how all of this happened? who all were involved in getting the show back?

when is it again?

There was a fundraiser at Siouxcountry. But the bulk of the money plus a kicker came from my friends at Unrealmuscle. The guys at Unreal raised more than $8,000 in a matter of hours.

[BadBoy]

it has just been announced tampa pro show for women is back!! we did it!!! and the prize money is higher!!!!! this is great news!!!!!:beerbang:
It's great news that the show is back. But I'm confused. How can the prize money be higher when there was no money to have the show in the first place until they held a charity fundraiser for it? Why not save any additional funds for a rainy day?

[BadBoy]

What has caused women's bbing to go from being on Wide World of Sports to having only 2 pro contests in 2009? Why are there no $$$ for this sport?
It's not on TV sports broadcasts anymore because the events themselves have no entertainment value except to the people with a vested interest in them.

People are making - and spending - plenty of money in bodybuilding. But just like everywhere else you go in life, some people get to fly first class, but most fly coach.