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View Full Version : Dangers of DNP ~ All you Need to Know



Sistersteel
05-09-2009, 11:00 PM
***Identification***

2,4-Dinitrophenol is a yellow crystalline (sand-like) solid but is often found in a solution. It is used in dyes, photo developers, explosives, and as a preservative of lumber. Dinitrophenols as a class of compounds, of which there are six members, do not occur naturally but are all manufactured compounds.

DNP is HIGHLY EXPLOSIVE, FLAMMABLE and REACTIVE when DRY, and a DANGEROUS FIRE and EXPLOSION HAZARD. Extreme caution must be exercised when handling, storing, and working with DNP in its raw form.
DNP IS A CELLULAR METABOLIC POISON. It uncouples oxidative phosphorylation by carrying protons across the mitochondrial membrane, leading to a rapid consumption of energy without generation of ATP.


***Pharmacological action***

In living cells, DNP acts as a proton ionophore, an agent that can shuttle protons (hydrogen ions) across biological membranes. It defeats the proton gradient across mitochondria and chloroplast membranes, collapsing the proton motive force that the cell uses to produce most of its ATP chemical energy. Instead of producing ATP, the energy of the proton gradient is lost as heat. Cells counteract the lowered yields of ATP by oxidizing more stored reserves such as carbohydrates and fat.

DNP is often used in biochemistry research to help explore the regulation of bioenergetics in different organisms.


***Use as dieting aid***

DNP was used extensively in the 1930s in diet pills after Cutting and Tainter at Stanford University made their first report on the drug's ability to greatly increase metabolic rate. DNP acts as a protonophore in the mitochondrial membrane, uncoupling oxidative phosphorylation and making ATP energy production less efficient. In effect, part of the energy that is normally produced from cellular respiration is wasted as heat. This inefficiency is proportional to the dose of DNP that is taken. Thus, as the dose increases and energy production is made less efficient, the metabolic rate is increased (and more fat is burned) in order to compensate for the inefficiency and meet energy demands. Interestingly, the factor that limits ever increasing doses of DNP is not a lack of ATP energy production, but rather an excessive rise in body temperature due to the heat produced during uncoupling. Accordingly, DNP overdose will cause a fatal fever. Concerns about dangerous side-effects and rapidly developing cataracts resulted in DNP being discontinued in the United States by the end of 1938. DNP, however, continues to be used by some bodybuilders and athletes to rapidly lose body fat. Fatal overdoses are rare, but are still reported on occasion.

While DNP itself is considered by many to be too risky for human use, its mechanism of action remains under investigation as a potential approach for treating obesity.

Sistersteel
05-09-2009, 11:01 PM
***Hazard Summary***

• 2,4-Dinitrophenol can effect you when breathed in and by passing through your skin.
• 2,4-Dinitrophenol can cause reproductive damage. Handle with extreme caution.
• 2,4-Dinitrophenol is a FLAMMABLE LIQUID and a FIRE HAZARD.
• Contact can irritate the skin. Long term exposure may cause dermatitis.
• 2,4-Dinitrophenol can irritate the eyes, and may cause clouding of the eye lenses (cataracts).
• Breathing 2,4-Dinitrophenol can irritate the nose and throat.
• High or repeated exposure can affect the nervous system causing nausea, vomiting, abdominal pain, convulsions and even death.
• 2,4-Dinitrophenol may damage the liver and kidneys.

Sistersteel
05-09-2009, 11:04 PM
***Acute Health Effects***
The following acute (short-term) health effects may occur immediately or shortly after exposure to 2,4-Dinitrophenol:

• 2,4-Dinitrophenol can irritate the skin and eyes.
• Breathing 2,4-Dinitrophenol can irritate the nose and throat.
• Exposure to 2,4-Dinitrophenol cause fatigue, thirst, sweating, headache and weakness. It may also cause anxiety and excitement.

***Chronic Health Effects***
The following chronic (long-term) health effects can occur at some time after exposure to 2,4-Dinitrophenol and can last for months or years:

***Cancer Hazard ***
According to the information presently available 2,4-dinitrophenol has not been tested for its ability to cause cancer in animals. As a rule phenols tend to be carcinogenic, but the effects that DNP has in that regards requires a more in-depth study to determine its effects.

***Reproductive Hazard ***
There is limited evidence that 2,4-dinitrophenol may damage the developing fetus meaning that feal damage has occured in a small percentage of women who were exposed to DNP, but the number could be purely coincidental. No controlled studies have been performed to prove this hazard.

***Cataract Development ***
The most notable health hazard that 2,4-dinitrophenol presents is the reason the FDA barred its use as a weight loss agent. During its short stay as the leading weight loss drug offered, less than 1% of the women who consumed this substance developed clouding of the eyes, or cataracts. Today, supplements are available to counter this effect as described in the Weight Loss section of this website.

***Other Long-Term Effects ***
• Exposure to 2,4-Dinitrophenol can cause dermatitis.
• High or repeated exposure can effect the nervous system causing nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, abdominal pain, headache, anxiety, weakness, convulsions and even death.
• 2,4-Dinitrophenol may damage the liver and kidneys.

Sistersteel
05-09-2009, 11:14 PM
***Weight Loss with DNP - Scientifically Speaking***

DNP accomplishes the astounding boost in metabolic rate via inhibition of the F0F1 ATP synthase molecule, located in the inner wall of each mitochondrion. While the electron transport chain still functions to pump hydrogen ions into the inter-membrane space, the coupling of the proton gradient to ATP production is rendered impossible by DNP. As a result, ATP production is dramatically reduced, and the energy is instead thrown off as heat. This results in an astounding production of heat; when using dinitrophenol, the athlete will radiate so much heat that it is uncomfortable to be within any proximity of them. Luckily, this heat does not fully contribute to body temperature increases, and is instead thrown off from the entire body surface, particularly the head. As a result, adequate doses of DNP will usually only elevate body temperature by about 1-1.5ēC. This is a good thing for your central nervous system and other delicate tissues. If the heat produced by ATP contributed in a more direct matter to body temperature, effective doses for fat loss would cause body temperature increase. Nonetheless, overheating is a very real danger.
Under these conditions, much of the food that we eat could not be used for ATP synthesis and we lose weight. However, too much inhibitor and we could make too little ATP for life. The difference between weight loss and death is only a small concentration change in dinitrophenol, making the drug dangerous. Simply put, this means that while eating your normal diet, you will have somewhere between 20% and 40% reduction of calories (Hardly worth the risk).

Sistersteel
05-09-2009, 11:17 PM
***Risks of using 2,4-Dinitrophenol DNP for Weight Loss***
Hearing all of these wonderful things probably has you wondering what the side effects and risks are. They are quite formidable and contribute to making DNP one of the most intolerable (though effective) drugs used in bodybuilding.

Overheating - There is no upper limit to DNP's body temperature increase, meaning that one may literally "cook from the inside" if they take too much. Dosage considerations will be given later, but even an overdose of 4-6 times the recommended dosage may be lethal. Much smaller overdoses may result in damage to the brain and/or other body systems such as the liver and kidneys. Supplements help reduce this risk.

Dehydration - Probably the single most dangerous aspect of DNP usage, dehydration sets in when the muscles and other body systems do not have enough glucose to stay properly hydrated. The body's temperature raise is much more harmful when it has no water to regulate temperatures and glucose levels. This can be battled by replacing electrolytes with Potassium supplementation and supplementing with Glycerol, a muscle hydrator and energizer.

Carcinogenesis - Phenols in general are reputed to be carcinogenic. Although 2,4-dinitrophenol has never been implicated in a cancer diagnosis, some are nonetheless concerned, and understandably so. In addition to the inherent carcinogenic potential caused by its status as a phenol, production of free radicals and the release of various compounds stored in adipose tissue stores during DNP's rapid oxidation of fat may also potentially be harmful.

Discomfort and sweating - This is the single most noticeable effect of DNP use, both by the user and those around him/her. Even in the winter, while indoors at ambient temperatures, one may expect his or her shirt to be completely soaked through with sweat. Those with jobs requiring formal or semi-formal apparel are advised to consider other means of fat loss (or a new job, if preferred). Other obvious considerations lie in the areas of social life, personal appearance, etc. and the user must prioritize.

Insomnia - Second in frequency of reports to sweating and discomfort is insomnia. This may be at least partially attributed to discomfort. Possible means of countering this include such supplements as Valerian root or melatonin. Alternatively, one may deal with this via prescription or OTC sleep medications or GHB-A precursors. However, these may be addictive if used on a regular basis and if their use may be avoided, by all means abstain from using them.

Yellow bodily fluids - Some don't notice this, but others find that all of their bodily fluids take on a yellowish appearance. Urine is a darker yellow, and even semen and vaginal secretions may be affected. According to current knowledge, this is not known to be harmful in and of itself.

Muscle soreness - This is yet another thing that may be minimized via cerebral function. Dan Duchaine has recommended using a weight such as to allow no fewer than 15 reps per set of any weight training workout; judging from anecdotal reports and personal experience, this seems to be good advice. Low levels of ATP are a cause of muscle soreness in and of itself. The additional factor of encumbered recovery mechanisms make extreme soreness (and if not careful, catabolism) quite possible.

Allergic reactions - These are highly individualized but may be summarily discussed. Various reactions are common with DNP use, and approximately 10% of users will be extremely allergic to it. Allergic reactions can include hives, blisters, and/or inexplicable rashes.

Carbohydrate Cravings - To counter this, some methods will be touched on later. As with most diets, willpower is sometimes the single most important factor. Other drugs such as Meridia and supplements such as Hot Rox give a user the edge to combat these cravings as well as boost energy.


CONSUMING DNP FOR WEIGHT LOSS PURPOSES IS NOT RECOMMENDED WHATSOEVER, but if you are exposed to it, you suffer any of these side effects, and they are extremely bothersome, it is the recommendation to cease contact immediately and see your physician as soon as possible. Do not attempt to continue the exposure at that point.

Sistersteel
05-09-2009, 11:27 PM
***Safe and Effective DNP Dosage... ***

...at least as safe as it gets when using DNP for weight loss. Dosing is highly individualized and most generalizations tend to collapse quite quickly. As a result, none will be attempted. Start on the low end of the scale and see how you react. It is not recommended to take more than 300mg at any one time.
Getting the right dosage of DNP is rather easy to do although the importance of proper dosage cannot be overstated. It is far better for one to err on the side of too little rather than too much, certainly in the case of the novice who does not know if they are allergic to the substance.

As stated before, the commonly used dosage by bodybuilders and other reasonably lean persons is 4-6mg/kg of bodyweight. This would mean that a 100-kilogram bodybuilder would use anywhere from 400-600mg per day. Experienced users commonly are found using up to 800mg/day relatively safely, and beginners sometimes find that they enjoy 3-5 pounds of fat loss per week with as little as 200mg/day.

So, a person weighing 200 lbs would weigh about 91 kg. So 4mgs per kg of body weight would be the equivalent of 364 mgs of DNP per day. Since DNP comes in 200 mg capsules (usually), the user would take one cap twice daily to stay within range. The lethal dose is a mere 32mg/kg...only 4 times the max effective dose of 800mg/day. The addage "more is better" does not ring true in this case. Heed the warning!


Beginners: Always start off small, say 200mg/day for 3-4 days to test your allergies. If no allergic reactions occur you may then consider increasing the dosage.


DNP should be taken in 8 to 12-day cycles to avoid liver and kidney damage and to allow your muscles to recover. Bodybuilders typically look their best 48 to 96 hours after cessation of usage. A 10-day cycle of 400mg per day (200mg twice daily) would be a typical effective dose for a 225lb man. This allows for a total of two weeks from start to finish with a 4-day recovery period. Positive results have been seen with a lower dose, but conversely, better results have been achieved safely with a higher dose. Positive results have been seen in users taking 200mg to 800mg per day. Keep the formula of 4-6mg/kg of body weight in mind.


As for the time of day, take each of two doses 12 hours apart (or 8 hours apart if taking 3 doses), one in the morning with food to maximize the calorie burning effects and the second dose just before bedtime with a snack to maximize your bodies natural nocturnal increase in resting metabolism. A larger man taking 600mg per day should divide the dose into a 5:00PM portion and another portion taken approximately 30 minutes before bedtime. Someone taking 200-300mg/day could easily take one dose in the evening.


This should not decrease thyroid output dramatically and makes use of T3 (triiodothyronine, brand name Cytomel) unnecessary in short cycles. T4-T3 conversion does decrease dramatically in the liver due to excessive heat over a longer period of exposure. This begins within 24 hours of the first dose. However, there is usually adequate active thyroid hormone to make it through 8-10 days (possibly up to 12 days depending on experience level) of using it while maintaining elevated body temperature. To ensure T3 levels remain adequate, one can supplement T3 starting 7 days before last dose and cycling through until 7 days after the last DNP dose to provide extra T3 support while your body's T3 producing abilities recover.


After approximately 3-5 days, the user may find themselves with a waking temperature that is no longer elevated, even though they are still using DNP. This is due to the decrease in T3 and may signal the necessity of either the use of exogenous T3 in subsequent cycles or shorter cycles of the drug. In addition, the schedule given works nicely because the user is able to enjoy the anabolic rebound effect on a relatively regular basis. Also, longer cycles might leave the muscle fibers in a state of relative dehydration and "starved" of ATP for too long; both of these readily contribute to catabolism.


Since DNP has this inhibiting effect, glycolosis is inhibited as well, causing a diabetic effect due to the conversion of glucose without insulin, so you may have heard that people take insulin with DNP. This will counter act the symptoms of lethargy and lack of energy due to DNP's use. Other supplementation is also suggested to limit side effects as stated later in this thread.

Sistersteel
05-09-2009, 11:28 PM
***Timetable of Effects and Symptoms of a DNP Cycle ***

Day 1 -None; possibly elevated carbohydrate cravings and/or temperature elevation.

Day 2 - T4-T3 conversion has begun to decrease; lethargy possible. Temperature should be elevated, and radiation of heat is noticeable.

Days 3-5 - Body temperature is elevated, with all the effects that one expects from DNP use. In addition, water retention usually becomes manifest here.

Days 6-10 - Definite water retention, along with other symptoms of use; user most likely feels fatter due to having "flatter" muscles (mainly the result of glycogen depletion) and holding water. Final DNP dose taken in the evening of Day 10.

Days 11-12 - DNP is clearing the system slowly. All symptoms are still present.

Days 13-14 - Water should be gone by now, or getting there. Mild diuretics will expedite this. The user will probably notice perceived greater cardiovascular and muscular endurance.

96 Hours After Final Dose - This is when someone tends to look their best. Their glycogen stores are usually compensated at this point and the retained water should be gone.

Sistersteel
05-09-2009, 11:35 PM
***Supplementation***
While using DNP, supplements can greatly aid both in the effectiveness of the therapy and the comfort of the user. Of particular importance are antioxidants and the following quantities are recommended:


Magnesium (1500mg)*
Vitamin C (3000mg in divided doses)*
Vitamin E (1200 IU in divided doses)*
Glutathione (200mg in divided doses)***)
NAC (various amounts)**
T3 (dose according to personal preference)**
Calcium (2000mg not taken with the Magnesium)
5-HTP (if not on antidepressant medication) (various amounts)****
Meridia, Redux, or Fenfluramine (various amounts)****
Hydroxycitric Acid (particularly in the evenings to curb cravings)****
Pyruvate (2-6g/day in divided doses)
Glycerol (3 tbsp/day in divided doses)
Alpha-Lipoic Acid (500-1000mg daily in divided doses)


Key:
* = Integral component of DNP program
** = Of questionable (although possible) importance)
*** = Of particular importance to women for prevention of cataracts
**** = For the purpose of appetite suppression (may not be needed)

Sistersteel
05-09-2009, 11:39 PM
***Practical Considerations***
Given all of this information, there are nonetheless more things to know before you undertake your first DNP cycle. The following tips and tricks gathered from personal experience and consultations with users are presented for your aid:


Aim a fan at your head at night. Your head is the most precious thing on your body and is a prime site for heat loss. Any air flowing over it will aid in cooling via convection.
Wash your bedding daily. It is a good idea to have some spare pillowcases on hand, if nothing else. Most likely, you will be sweating profusely while you sleep, and this will make your bed smell as enticing as a locker room. Cleanliness is also essential in the prevention of disease, not to mention the fact that you are breathing out DNP "fumes" all night and they collect on your bedding.
Prevention of disease goes beyond washing your clothes, and includes all of the normal precautions that you would make to avoid infection, although in a more exaggerated way. DNP depletes your body of energy needed to battle pathogens and weakens your immune system, leaving you ripe for infection and incapable of fighting off most diseases once they have taken hold.
This is rather intuitive, but be certain to wear loose, light clothing, preferably of a light color.
Similarly intuitive is the desire to remain in a cool area … be CERTAIN not to overheat.
Proper hydration is necessary – I have personally consumed up to 8 liters of water per day. Glycerol specifically aids in muscle hydration, so its use may be very important, particularly when considering that muscle cells in even a semi-dehydrated state are prime sites for catabolism.
Cardiovascular work while on DNP – This is a strange issue that I have been asked about regularly, but am undecided in the direction to take and generally recommend that the user decide for themselves. My personal preference is to do cardio with a fan focused on me for 30-35 minutes at a relatively high intensity. This is an area for personal preference; barring other considerations, just see if you can handle it or not and go from there. Always be ready to stop if you feel yourself getting extremely overheated or weak.
Diet - One may wonder why this issue receives such limited attention; after all, most methods of fat loss require a restrictive diet of some nature. However, there is no set diet that one must use to achieve good results with dinitrophenol, only certain factors that allow the user to decide intelligently how to eat:

Insulin - DNP blunts the effects of insulin; this is a huge boon for dieters because insulin blocks lipolysis and causes the storage of
adipose tissue. This means that carbohydrate intake does not need to be strictly limited, although it should stay reasonable for optimal
results.

Body Temperature and Comfort - A general guideline is that the more carbohydrates eaten, the hotter the user will get while on DNP. Similarly, overfeeding also produces extreme heat; any excess calories are thrown off as heat quite readily. For this reason, along with certain hormonal factors, Duchaine espouses an Isometric diet while on DNP, and I have followed this personally with good results.

CKD's - These are extremely impractical while on a cyclical ketogenic diet (CKD), and are especially dangerous. This brings up blood glucose considerations; it is important to try to maintain relatively stable, or at least not severely depressed, blood glucose levels. If this guideline is not followed, the user may experience blurred vision and/or extreme fatigue possibly augmented by fainting or lightheadedness.

***Anabolic rebound effect ***– Dan Duchaine spoke of this effect regarding DNP a while back. At the time, it seemed impossible. But I know of many who have experienced this phenomenon, and it indeed happens. Possible causes include, but are not limited to, either an anabolic effect from glycogen supercompensation-induced cellular expansion, or due to increased mitochondrial density. Increased mitochondrial density is an adaptive mechanism of the body and takes place surprisingly quickly in the presence of an uncoupler such as DNP (or anything else that inhibits oxidative phosphorylation). Whatever the mechanism of the anabolic rebound effect may be, the user can expect to gain about 5-7 pounds of intramuscular water or muscle and lose about the same amount of subcutaneous and intraperitoneal water within a week after their last DNP dose. This is probably the most pleasant aspect of using DNP; the user not only experiences unrivaled fat loss, but also enjoys a fair amount of hypertrophy without any other supplements or drugs. Muscle retention, and possibly gain, is improved with careful attention to several previously discussed considerations such as proper hydration and intelligent cycling.

JVALDEZ
05-09-2009, 11:50 PM
Can dnp be taken with other anaolics?

Sistersteel
05-09-2009, 11:57 PM
Conclusion


Currently, DNP is the most powerful weapon against fat loss in the bodybuilder's arsenal; however, this does not necessarily mean that it is right for everyone or is by any means safe. The possibility also exists that PGF2 may be better for some people, particularly when taking the fact that it may kill fat cells into consideration. However, the guidelines given here will allow the user unrivaled fat loss, and will do so quite safely provided that precautionary measures are taken.

I personally do NOT condone the use of DNP for any reason. The risks and dangers far outweigh the benefits. Comparable or better results can be achieved with proper diet, training and cardio. Quick fixes always come with a hefty price.

Sistersteel
05-10-2009, 12:06 AM
Can dnp be taken with other anaolics?

Many "Gurus" are recommending DNP as a component to any steroid cycle to ensure that weight gained is purely muscle and not fat. While this certainly works great on paper, application is a little different. I am a firm believer in training and eating to grow while on a heavy cycle. Taking DNP while cycling will certainly help keep you leaner. It will also make you weaker, uncomfortable, and more quick to tire from a workout. Obviously not a good idea while kicking ass in the gym and a complete waste of gear if you ask me.

SS

sassy69
05-10-2009, 12:27 AM
A consideration w/ DNP is the extreme stress it puts on your system (ref the whole pile of supps SS lists above), is the additional stress of anything else you put in your system or do while you're running a DNP cycle. If you're out partying, drinking, dancing when you're dehydrated from DNP, it is not a good thing. If you choose to run DNP it has to be respected, and your lifestyle needs to support your body while it is under this stress.

Sistersteel
05-10-2009, 12:39 AM
A consideration w/ DNP is the extreme stress it puts on your system (ref the whole pile of supps SS lists above), is the additional stress of anything else you put in your system or do while you're running a DNP cycle. If you're out partying, drinking, dancing when you're dehydrated from DNP, it is not a good thing. If you choose to run DNP it has to be respected, and your lifestyle needs to support your body while it is under this stress.

Precisely. Please feel free to add to this thread, sass, as you see fit. The more thorough we can be, the easier it will make our lives anytime we have a legitimate concern to address. I would like this to be a one stop, all inclusive write up on DNP that will serve as an educational read to everyone before we offer any advice. Better to educate people first rather than feel obligated to go through a list of disclaimers every time we need to answer a simple question.

Gunz
05-10-2009, 09:10 AM
Conclusion


Currently, DNP is the most powerful weapon against fat loss in the bodybuilder's arsenal; however, this does not necessarily mean that it is right for everyone or is by any means safe. The possibility also exists that PGF2 may be better for some people, particularly when taking the fact that it may kill fat cells into consideration. However, the guidelines given here will allow the user unrivaled fat loss, and will do so quite safely provided that precautionary measures are taken.

I personally do NOT condone the use of DNP for any reason. The risks and dangers far outweigh the benefits. Comparable or better results can be achieved with proper diet, training and cardio. Quick fixes always come with a hefty price.

Thanks for the very thorough explanation. Scares the S*!?T out of me!!

Now can you explain what PGF2 as referenced above is, please?

RealLilSwole
05-10-2009, 10:04 AM
Now there is a drug I can say I will NEVER try!

GirlyMuscle
05-10-2009, 10:27 AM
Now there is a drug I can say I will NEVER try!
Ditto.

Thank you for the very thorough explanation. And the red highlights. :D

tammyp
05-10-2009, 12:23 PM
damn..im scared just READING this!

Sistersteel
05-10-2009, 12:33 PM
Thanks for the very thorough explanation. Scares the S*!?T out of me!!

Now can you explain what PGF2 as referenced above is, please?

I have a lot of info on PGF2 but it does not belong in the women's forum. If you are interested in a more thorough explanation, then I will be happy to make a sticky on it in the Men's Chemical Enhancement.

PFG2 is not used by women as they will not reap any of the benefits of the drug but rather it will induce an excruciating pain in the ovaries. Tht is because It is used to abort fetuses in cow, pigs, and horses by making their uterus and other reproductive organs contract and constrict. NOT good. I made reference to it only to compare its fat loss capabilities to DNP.

In brief, prostaglandin F2 alpha or PGF2 for short is a local acting hormone that exerts its effect within the tissues it is secreted in. Its mechanism of action is much like IGF1 whereby it promotes muscle growth yada yada yada. Like DNP its fat burning properties result from a rise in body temperature. It is muscle sparing and completely kills fat cells rather than shrink them like most diets do.

Just another dangerous drug with sides that far outweigh any of its benefits.
Its almost as though diets are not even needed anymore these days with all the stupid quick fixes available.

SS

sassy69
05-10-2009, 02:20 PM
Precisely. Please feel free to add to this thread, sass, as you see fit. The more thorough we can be, the easier it will make our lives anytime we have a legitimate concern to address. I would like this to be a one stop, all inclusive write up on DNP that will serve as an educational read to everyone before we offer any advice. Better to educate people first rather than feel obligated to go through a list of disclaimers every time we need to answer a simple question.


The specific illustration I had in mind was the death of Eric Perin back in 2001, from DNP that he allegedly purchased from an online source. In looking for a good article, I found many that use it as an example of the freewheeling internet and how there's nothing you can't find, so instead I'm lifting this article from a different muscle board. Apologies I couldn't find the original newspaper link.

There has been discussion that he was actually out partying, may have had other party drugs in his body that, along w/ the dehydration & stress from the DNP, was just too much for his system. Even if he'd been drinking or dancing or anything that would further dehydrate him, it could be fatal. So that's what I'm saying when DNP stresses the shit out of your system, and you may not even realize just how much. And again, for the lbs that you could lose running DNP cycle, you can do the same w/ diet & cardio, letting your body do what it does best, w/o the stress.

Just like AAS, or aspirin or anything else, just because it exists doesn't mean you have to use it. That's where education, information and discpline / patience come into play. Not to get preachy, but anyone who has pursued competition can tell you, even after a lifetime of looking for the 'ultimate diet pill' or quicky fix, it doesn't exist. Something may work for a while, but eventually it won't and your body will take control and respond how it is designed to respond - i.e. rebound or become catabolic /hold fat. There simply is no substitute for optimized diet, training, cardio, persistence and patience.

September 25, 2001

Federal agents have arrested an Indiana man who allegedly used the Internet to sell a banned weight-loss drug that caused the death of a Baldwin man who took it for bodybuilding, according to officials and the victim's family.

Sean Zhang, 24, of Bloomington, Ind., was held on $100,000 bail after a hearing yesterday at U.S. District Court in Indianapolis.

Authorities said Zhang had sold the drug dinitrophenol to Eric Perrin, 22, of Baldwin, a Cornell junior who died Aug. 6. Perrin's parents, Steven and Barbara Perrin, said their son had dropped out of school "to find himself" but became increasingly "obsessed with bodybuilding" and took dinitrophenol, commonly called DNP, to slim his waist.

The couple said in an interview yesterday that they knew the dangers of the drug but agreed to "sit vigil by him" while he took it because he threatened to move out of their home and take the drug elsewhere.

"It was foolish," said Barbara Perrin, a third-grade teacher, explaining she thought Eric had given them no choice. "I hope this will lead body-builders to understand how dangerous the drug is. They should post signs in all the gyms warning about DNP," she said.

Four days after taking the drug, Perrin started having trouble breathing and was rushed to South Nassau Communities Hospital in Oceanside, where he died.

"It's been a horror, an absolute horror. Eric was the love of my life," Barbara Perrin said.

"He was a super-bright kid," said Steven Perrin, an accountant, saying their son had been on the Cornell dean's list, had won a top math prize at Baldwin High School and played saxophone in the all-Nassau High School band.

DNP has been touted in the past by some as a miracle weight-loss drug, but it was banned for use by humans in the 1930s because of its toxicity. As a chemical, dinitrophenol is legally sold as a pesticide and for the manufacture of dyes and wood preservatives.

The death of Perrin was the first in recent years caused by DNP, according to Stewart Magee, regional head of investigations for the Food and Drug Administration.

According to court papers, Perrin contacted Zhang through an encrypted Internet chatroom that is used by bodybuilders interested in illegal drugs.

Zhang was charged under Food and Drug Administration statutes with two counts of selling a drug without proper warning labels. The first count was for allegedly selling the dinitrophenol to Perrin on July 30. The second count was for allegedly selling it to an undercover federal agent on Sept. 8.

Zhang moved from Gaithersburg, Md. to Bloomington, Ind., shortly after Perrin died, but the indictment does not link the move to Perrin's death.

Neither Zhang nor his attorney could be reached to comment. If convicted, Zhang could face up to 6 years in prison.

Sources said Zhang was not charged with more serious crimes because there was no evidence he knew the drug would cause Perrin's death.

After Perrin died, Zhang continued to sell DNP over the Internet, saying it was "the most effective tool available today for the loss of body fat," according to U.S. Attorney Alan Vinegrad. Authorities said the death was reported in the Internet chat room that Zhang used, but they did not say whether Zhang knew of the death.

"Zhang's indictment and arrest should send a clear message to those who would profit from the sale of unapproved drugs," Vinegrad said. "We urge everyone not to use this drug as a weight loss remedy or ingest it for any reason."

Vinegrad said the Food and Drug Administration had set up a phone number for questions about DNP: 301-827-6250.

John Romano
05-10-2009, 04:33 PM
A consideration w/ DNP is the extreme stress it puts on your system (ref the whole pile of supps SS lists above), is the additional stress of anything else you put in your system or do while you're running a DNP cycle. If you're out partying, drinking, dancing when you're dehydrated from DNP, it is not a good thing. If you choose to run DNP it has to be respected, and your lifestyle needs to support your body while it is under this stress.

This is exactly right. I have used DNP several times with astounding results. It is indeed a drug to be respected, however it is no more lethal than any drugs on which you can OD. DNP, used intelligently and responsibly - in short duration - rids the body of even stubborn fat. It really is amazing. PGF2 also sounds good but I have yet to try it. I'm sure I will though....

Gunz
05-10-2009, 09:45 PM
I have a lot of info on PGF2 but it does not belong in the women's forum. If you are interested in a more thorough explanation, then I will be happy to make a sticky on it in the Men's Chemical Enhancement.

PFG2 is not used by women as they will not reap any of the benefits of the drug but rather it will induce an excruciating pain in the ovaries. Tht is because It is used to abort fetuses in cow, pigs, and horses by making their uterus and other reproductive organs contract and constrict. NOT good. I made reference to it only to compare its fat loss capabilities to DNP.

In brief, prostaglandin F2 alpha or PGF2 for short is a local acting hormone that exerts its effect within the tissues it is secreted in. Its mechanism of action is much like IGF1 whereby it promotes muscle growth yada yada yada. Like DNP its fat burning properties result from a rise in body temperature. It is muscle sparing and completely kills fat cells rather than shrink them like most diets do.

Just another dangerous drug with sides that far outweigh any of its benefits.
Its almost as though diets are not even needed anymore these days with all the stupid quick fixes available.

SS

Since you made reference to PFG2, I just wanted to know what it is. Knowledge and education.....Thanks.

Frosty
05-10-2009, 11:20 PM
I love DNP. I've played with it in the past. Awesome stuff with no noticeable immediate side effects in lower doses. Done blitz cycles where you feel like death. I think they're dumb, in my opinion. 100 to maybe 200mg per day for a longer time so you can run a lower carb diet and not feel like death, not be sweating in 40 degree weather, not soaking your bed in sweat... lol

Definitely run antioxidants with it. Vitamin E, Na-r-ALA, NAC, broad spectrum antioxidants.

John Romano
05-11-2009, 11:51 AM
I love DNP. I've played with it in the past. Awesome stuff with no noticeable immediate side effects in lower doses. Done blitz cycles where you feel like death. I think they're dumb, in my opinion. 100 to maybe 200mg per day for a longer time so you can run a lower carb diet and not feel like death, not be sweating in 40 degree weather, not soaking your bed in sweat... lol

Definitely run antioxidants with it. Vitamin E, Na-r-ALA, NAC, broad spectrum antioxidants.

totally agree!

I took 60 mg BID (210 pounds @8%BF) Ran that for 8 weeks and got clipped again (same tech, same Skindex [Pollok scale], same time of day as prior) at 208 pounds @3.8%. I discontinued DNP at 8 weeks and continued my prep for my target date 2 weeks away. I got clipped again on my target date (same tech, same Skindex, same time of day as prior) at 204 pounds @ 2.6%. Crazy shredded. My legs didn't look like they had skin on them.

Two following courses of similar duration - the first about 18 months after, and the third about two years after that) saw similar results with no adverse events, no discomfort, a little sweaty at night, and an average temp (taken every six hours) of 100.4.

I'm looking for some right now....

sassy69
05-11-2009, 11:56 AM
totally agree!

I took 60 mg BID (210 pounds @8%BF) Ran that for 8 weeks and got clipped again (same tech, same Skindex [Pollok scale], same time of day as prior) at 208 pounds @3.8%. I discontinued DNP at 8 weeks and continued my prep for my target date 2 weeks away. I got clipped again on my target date (same tech, same Skindex, same time of day as prior) at 204 pounds @ 2.6%. Crazy shredded. My legs didn't look like they had skin on them.

Two following courses of similar duration - the first about 18 months after, and the third about two years after that) saw similar results with no adverse events, no discomfort, a little sweaty at night, and an average temp (taken every six hours) of 100.4.

I'm looking for some right now....


Watch your mailbox John! Scammer invite!

Sistersteel
05-11-2009, 12:11 PM
Watch your mailbox John! Scammer invite!

Oh no...lol

Sistersteel
05-11-2009, 12:12 PM
I am yet to find a medically supported argument as to why DNP works so well for some and not at all for others.

John Romano
05-11-2009, 02:51 PM
Watch your mailbox John! Scammer invite!

Two things:

1 - I'm looking for some because I know where to look

2 - Scam me? Please...... It would be so entertaining if someone tried

HeavyDutyGuy
05-11-2009, 05:19 PM
A CELLULAR METABOLIC POISON? You have to be insane to put that in your body.

Frosty
05-11-2009, 08:51 PM
Two things:

1 - I'm looking for some because I know where to look

2 - Scam me? Please...... It would be so entertaining if someone tried

Lucky bastard. Sources are hard to come by. Previous sources are laying low and some have totally discontinued the sale of it. :(

John Romano
05-12-2009, 10:10 AM
A CELLULAR METABOLIC POISON? You have to be insane to put that in your body.

"One man's meat is another man's poison"

Peaceful28
05-12-2009, 07:51 PM
Sounds like scary stuff. :(

John Romano
05-13-2009, 12:27 AM
Sounds like scary stuff. :(

nahhhhhhh........

Angela123
05-22-2009, 12:24 AM
SS, thanks for posting this. Great valuable info. Scary stuff though!

branch
05-25-2009, 10:53 AM
its not so bad first few days r rough, just gotta suck it up like anything else


john u have any input on using slin with dnp i found an article stating you should use it what do you think...


http://www.anabolicextreme.com/anabolic/archives/anex_archive_issue2_dnpinsulin2.htm

DNP Cycles
DNP cycles are created out of a need to balance the benefits of DNP with the many unpleasant side effects of the drug. For the dosing schedule of DNP, please refer to Part I of this article in the archives section. The eight-day cycles allow for significant fat loss to occur while allowing the user to recover from the trauma of using the drug. Most individuals find themselves at the end of their rope, so to speak, at the end of the eight days. Additionally, longer cycles might result in muscle catabolism as a result of decreased ATP levels within the muscle cell and an inability for the user to effectively train with weights. The dosing schedule advocated in Part I of this article allows for two brief DNP cycles during a "cleaning out" period from anabolics. Not only does this help keep bodyfat levels low, but the anabolic rebound effect experienced after a DNP cycle helps maintain lean body mass while off steroids.
Insulin
Insulin therapy is crucial to achieve the massive size exhibited by today's professional bodybuilders. However, extreme caution must be exercised when using insulin to avoid a dangerous drop in blood sugars. Compounding this problem is the fact that significant amounts of insulin must be used to achieve the desired effect. In my research, I've seen very few articles accurately state the amount of insulin that should be used to induce anabolism. Most articles quote figures that are next to useless, in the range of 1-3 iu's a few times a day. Realistically, insulin is most effective when used in the 30-40 iu's a day range, with some professional bodybuilders using 3 times that amount!
Carbohydrates must be consumed every time a dose of insulin is administered. A good rule of thumb is to consume 10 grams of carbohydrates for every 1 iu of insulin that is used. Since most doses should be in the 10 iu range, you must consume 100 grams of carbohydrate to protect yourself from hypoglycemia. These carbs should consist of a combination of simple and complex carbs. A few examples of this would be eating a banana with rice or drinking fruit juice with a baked potato. It's imperative that you always have an emergency source of simple carbohydrates on you at all times, whether it be a soft drink, candy bar, or tube of glucose paste. It's also a good idea to inform the people around you that you are using insulin so they know what to do if you start acting funny. Simply tell people that you have been diagnosed as a diabetic and go over the symptoms of getting "low" with them. I go so far as to wear a medic alert bracelet stating I'm a diabetic. Lastly, you should obtain a glucagon pen in case you really get in trouble. Glucagon has the opposite effect of insulin and will cause a massive release of glycogen from your liver and muscle cells.
While insulin will certainly cause anabolism, it also has a tendency to make you fat. The dosing schedule described in Part I of this article solves that dilemma. When insulin is used during a steroid cycle, the fat burning properties of the steroids keeps fat gain to a minimum. When it's used during the cleaning out period, the simultaneous use of DNP will actually cause a reduction in bodyfat while the insulin keeps the loss of lean body mass at a minimum.

SallyAnne
05-25-2009, 11:22 AM
I think that used responsibly, DNP works wonders...but IMO it's only a temporary and most everyone will gain back all the weight they took off once they stop using it. Most people don't have the discipline to keep their diet strict during and after DNP use, so rebounds usually always happen.

If you're looking for a long term weight loss solution, IMO - DNP is not for you.

branch
05-26-2009, 11:22 AM
I think that used responsibly, DNP works wonders...but IMO it's only a temporary and most everyone will gain back all the weight they took off once they stop using it. Most people don't have the discipline to keep their diet strict during and after DNP use, so rebounds usually always happen.

If you're looking for a long term weight loss solution, IMO - DNP is not for you.

noi have a show next weekend in ny just tryin it out for 10 days i get done on fri and then wait for the water retention togo down next week once i stop the gh and dnp this week, i look hard as shit now just holdin water.

i plan on carb depletin sat - wed then carb load thurs n fri depending on how i look

Klaus Urine
06-25-2009, 04:40 PM
You would suggest taking Clenbuterol with DNP?
Fuck.

SallyAnne
06-25-2009, 05:01 PM
I only know of one person who took both together...

I think DNP by itself would be miserable enough.

Klaus Urine
06-25-2009, 11:06 PM
If one tried to stack additional metabolic stimulators with DNP, they should tread carefully..Or quit being retards. Honestly, that sounds like a recipe for disaster.

saiyajinali
06-25-2009, 11:58 PM
Or quit being retards. Honestly, that sounds like a recipe for disaster.

I want to know if this gentleman has personally tried this himself..

Klaus Urine
06-26-2009, 12:09 AM
I want to know if this gentleman has personally tried this himself..Who?

-BLP-
06-26-2009, 03:55 AM
i never try but i was rave by usnic acid of palumbo species lypolize , wow great supp..

saiyajinali
06-26-2009, 08:45 AM
i never try but i was rave by usnic acid of palumbo species lypolize , wow great supp..
Yeah you are right BLP, my wife Debbie loves lypolize.

SallyAnne
06-29-2009, 05:35 PM
Only if you ingore the dose response. You don't hear of people taking 250mg of ephedrine and 2g of caffeine and then complaining about how bad it is. DNP is miserable if you choose to make it miserable by taking a high dose. It's baffling to me that so many bros run high dose "inferno cycles" and then act surprised, bitching about the bad side effects. A low dose of DNP can increase metabolic rate by 30% with little to no side effects. I've run several low dose cycles and besides an increased sensation of warmth and increased sweating in the gym, I don't have any prominent side effects.

I have to agree with you that many people tend to lean toward the "more is better" theory. I have run DNP before and had good results at a very low dose, but I was short of breath in the gym and ran out of steam a lot earlier.

sassy69
07-11-2009, 07:23 PM
Here's a little tidbit I just read on a different board.... Of the stories you hear about where DNP use turned out really bad, there was either booze / party drugs / dehydration involved, or an allergic reaction.

To avoid the first situation, is obvious. Respect the DNP if you're gonna play with it. In fact set aside your whole life & existence and make supporting your body while on, the priority. Minimize additional stresses to your system, and obviously avoid drugs or alcohol or other dehydration-inducing things.

To the other, I know a lot of people keep Benedryl around to help w/ the allergic reaction. Another little bit I heard was to use Quercitin to help reduce the allergic reaction. Its a really cheap supplement you can get most anywhere.

http://www.immunesupport.com/92fal004.htm

Quercetin—The Anti-Allergy Bioflavonoid
Every spring, summer and fall millions of Americans sneeze, wheeze, drip, and sniffle their way through a world filled with trillions of airborne pollen, dust, and smoke particles. Over-the-counter anti-allergy drugs (antihistamines) tend to leave their users either sleepy or over-stimulated. Fortunately, modern nutritional science now offers a highly effective, natural and nontoxic remedy for allergies: the bioflavonoid quercetin.
Quercetin, a "cousin" of the more well-known bioflavonoid rutin, is one of a thousand or so members of the bioflavonoid family. This is a group of coloring pigments widely found throughout the plant kingdom, where they also provide plants with antioxidant protection against environmental stresses. Natural diets high in vegetables, fruit, sprouts, and whole grains typically provide a total of 1,000 to 2,000 mg. a day of a broad range of flavonoids. Blue-green algae are the usual source of quercetin, but it's also available as a food supplement.
Allergies and asthma are inflammatory conditions usually triggered by air- or food-borne pollens and chemicals called "allergens." After these allergens are absorbed into the blood (through the lungs, skin, or intestines), they cause the B cells (white blood cells) of allergy-sufferers to produce billions of molecules of the allergic antibody IgE. The IgE molecules then travel through the bloodstream until they combine to with mast cells or basophils. Mast cells (which line many blood vessels) and basophils (a type of white blood cell circulating in the bloodstream) are the main storage sites for histamine and serotonin. The IgE allergic antibody then causes the cell membranes of the mast cells/basophils to become "leaky, " allowing their storage load of histamine and serotonin to pour into the surrounding blood and tissues. The IgE-released histamine and serotonin then produce the familiar allergic symptoms of runny, swollen nose; blocked sinuses; itchy eyes; skin blotches; coughing and wheezing; etc.
Quercetin to the rescue! Quercetin has a strong affinity for mast cells and basophils. It tends to stabilize their cell membranes, preventing them from spilling their pro-inflammatory, allergy-symptom-causing load of histamine/serotonin into the surrounding blood and tissue in response to the IgE antibody. And without the release of these potent inflammatory mediators, the familiar misery of allergies simply will not occur, even though you've inhaled the pollen, animal hair, or whatever normally triggers allergy attacks.
Asthma is an allergic inflammation involving the lungs. During an asthma attack (which can be triggered by air- or food-borne pollen, dust, animal hair, chemicals, etc.), the millions of tiny air sacs within the lungs are constricted, seriously impairing breathing and causing a feeling of tightness in the chest. In addition to IgE-released histamine, the primary biochemical cause of the asthmatic symptoms is a group of fatty acid derivatives called leukotrienes (LTs). These asthma-causing LTs are made from arachidonic acid (a key fatty acid constituent of many cell membranes) by the action of two enzymes - phospholipase A2 and lipoxygenase. Quercetin is known to be a powerful inhibitor of both these enzymes. Thus it prevents the formation of asthma-causing LTs, even when the IgE antibody (formed in response to inhaled or swallowed allergens) is present in the lungs to stimulate LT Production and release. Since quercetin suppresses the release and/or production of the two primary inflammatory mediators–histamine and leukotrienes–that cause the actual symptoms of asthma, its potential benefit in the prevention and treatment of asthma is evident.
Quercetin is a safe, nontoxic substance. A report by I. Hirono et al in Cancer Letters (1981), for example, found no evidence of toxicity or carcinogenicity in rats, even when quercetin made up 10 percent of their total dietary intake.
Unfortunately, quercetin is barely soluble in water, so poor dietary absorption may limit its efficacy. Because of this, Murray, N.D., has suggested that quercetin be taken in combination with bromelain to improve its absorption. Bromelain is a natural, protein-digesting enzyme derived from pineapples. It has been used "to increase absorption of compounds, including antibiotics. Also, bromelain has powerful anti-inflammatory properties that synergize with quercetin. Bromelain inhibits several other common inflammatory mediators, including bradykinin and fibrin. It's widely used in sports medicine to reduce the pain and swelling of bruises, sprains, muscle tears, etc., for this reason.
As a clinical nutritionist I have had numerous occasions to use quercetin on allergy and asthma suffers. About 1,000 to 2,000 mg. a day, divided into three to six doses, is sufficient to control most cases of allergy and many cases of asthma. I have remained virtually allergy and asthma free for several years through daily use of quercetin, and finding it much more effective for this purpose than other bioflavonoids.
Lets Live Magazine, September, 1992