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  1. #1
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    Default Overall Cycle Question

    Hey everyone! I have a male coach who is very smart BUT when it comes to his female clients, I am the only one he has competing in figure and also the only one running multiple chemicals. I just wanted input from other females with experience on what they thought of this cycle:

    12 weeks Primo 200mg/week
    6 weeks Anavar 25mg/day then 50mg/day last 6 weeks
    6 weeks Winnie 25mg/day then 50mg/day last 6 weeks
    30 days out start proviron (not sure on dosing yet)

    Also, should I use nolvadex with this? I will also be using clen/ECA stacks (clen one week, ECA next week rotation), and low doses of T3 starting 6 weeks out.

    Any advice/suggestions are appreciated!

    Little bit of a background note: I used primo at 150mg/week for 12 weeks during my off season and had great results from it, I absolutely love it! My first show prep last year I only used clen, var, and winnie and had good results, I was just way too small for figure.

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    Quote Originally Posted by cfig91 View Post
    Hey everyone! I have a male coach who is very smart BUT when it comes to his female clients, I am the only one he has competing in figure and also the only one running multiple chemicals. I just wanted input from other females with experience on what they thought of this cycle:

    12 weeks Primo 200mg/week
    6 weeks Anavar 25mg/day then 50mg/day last 6 weeks
    6 weeks Winnie 25mg/day then 50mg/day last 6 weeks
    30 days out start proviron (not sure on dosing yet)

    Also, should I use nolvadex with this? I will also be using clen/ECA stacks (clen one week, ECA next week rotation), and low doses of T3 starting 6 weeks out.

    Any advice/suggestions are appreciated!

    Little bit of a background note: I used primo at 150mg/week for 12 weeks during my off season and had great results from it, I absolutely love it! My first show prep last year I only used clen, var, and winnie and had good results, I was just way too small for figure.
    My usual recommendations can be found in this stickie: http://forums.rxmuscle.com/showthrea...omen-amp-Drugs

    So is this is a 12 week cycle of that stuff stacked for FIGURE? LMAO @ creating Physique so women use less steroids.

    Here's my first thing if you aren't big enough for Figure, then take a year off and build so you are. IMO that's is something that gets lost w/ the creation of these other categories relative to the history of FBB - the bodybuilders put in the years of work before expecting to jump on stage, whereas a lot of the newer girls find coaches that will load them up w/ drugs so they can get on stage ASAP and frequently as opposed to just growing the damn muscle and allowing the body to accommodate it.

    OK sorry, went off on a rant, but I see it all the time. IMO that's just overkill for drugs and if you're not where you want to be for stage, then schedule a decent off-season and then pick a show that you are ready for.

    Here's how I look at stacks:

    First 6 weeks:
    200mg/week primo
    + 175 mg/week var (7days/week x 25mg/day )
    + 175 mg/week winstrol (7 days/week x 25mg/day)
    ----------------------
    550 mg/week (keep in mind 250 mg/week of test is HRT for men)

    Then for the remainign 6 weeks:
    200mg/week primo
    + 350 mg/week var (7days/week x 50mg/day )
    + 350 mg/week winstrol (7 days/week x 50mg/day)
    ----------------------
    900 mg/week (keep in mind 250 mg/week of test is HRT for men and a gram of test /week is usually the cap for most guys who cycle).

    So, yea, overkill.

    The 200 mg primo I don't have a big problem with but there's something to be said about finding the "sweet spot" in a cycle. I'm not getting too excited about this particular total for a 7 day period, but I'd rather suggest you look at primo (I assume you're talking injectable primo depot), in a 5 day inject schedule - I'd say 150 mg/primo E5D is still a bit stiff if you're stacking w/ other stuff, and I'd rather suggest you cap it at 100mg E5D.

    The var & primo - honestly there's NO REASON to jack it THAT FAR. I'd cap it at 20mg /day MAX for this stuff. IMO It is supporting the stronger primo. I'm also not sure you really need wintrol at all if your'e running primo. MAYBE the last 6 weeks at maybe 10 mg ED (oral) or 25mg (inject) E3D. I would also suggest you DROP the var at 7-10 days out instead of increasing it because many women retain water on it and that can screw up your dial-in to stage day big time. That least week you want to keep things as simple and consistent as possible so your body doesn't experience some change it can't assimilate and its first reaction is to hold water. I'd bet your coach would then throw in a shit ton of diuretics to deal w/ water that should've never even been there if the var wasnt' promoting it. More drugs doesn't fix what the other drugs are causing.

    Look at what you're stacking: You've run this stuff together before, but you didn't mention the dosages. Both primo & winstrol are androgenic - expect your hair to fall out, your voice to crack & deepen and your joints are going to tell you to go fuck yourself w/ the winstrol for that long and in that dosage. (And the obvious promotion of joint issues ...). I would also suggest your BP is going to be off the charts. Don't forget when we're talking about side effects , it isn't just the visual / androgenic stuff - it also beats on your endocrine system. I'd also venture that coming off this giant stack you're going to experience some fun depression as your hormones get back in order. (The whole effect is not unlike "That Time Of The Month". Regardless of how much of all this stuff you use, it's an aggressive stack so I'd also supplement w/ acidophilus to help prevent any yeast infections. I would also include some BP & cholesterol support like Cholest-off or a cheaper combo of red yeast rice + non-flushing niacin + 200 mg CoQ10. (You can google about OTC supps that help w/ high cholesterol & blood pressure to find details about this.)

    50 mg /day is massive massive massive overkill. The reason guys don't run orals for long periods of time is that the dosage they use can be very hard on the liver. The reason women don't sweat it so much is that the usual dosage is pretty small. 50-100 mg is a guy's dose. There's just no fucking reason a Figure competitor needs to take this much stuff.

    Proviron - shit w/ all this other stuff, particularly the winstrol, I can't imagine why you need to throw that on top too. The judges don't want peeled figure competitors and if your water isn't controlled by the time you hit stage, you're either not ready (carrying too much fat) or you really need to revisit your diet.

    Two other questions:

    1) Who is paying for this cycle? Primo ain't cheap and enough anavar to support, let's see: 7x25mgx6weeks + 7x50mgx6weeks = 3150 mg of var?

    2) Do you trust your source? Primo depot tends to be one of the most frequently faked compounds. Anavar as well - very easy to sub in dbols for var tabs. If it's a UGL cap, who the hell knows what is in it or how strong / not strong it is. If there's any chance whatever compounds you got from whoever, isn't what they say it is and in the advertised dosage, for a woman's endocrine system and relative levels of testosterone that can be a REALLY bad result. Unless you enjoy singing 1st alto for the East German Women's Choir and are very proud of your goatee. This is another reason we recommend very conservative doses for women. Steroids are not exactly an FDA approved, Quality Controlled and federally regulated distribution process. You are literally your very own petri dish.

    Whoever your coach is, he's pulling out all the tricks of a very seasoned FBB for this show. WAYYYY overkill. Please see the stickie I linked above. For women MORE isn't better. It just isn't. The dosages I outline in there are where I'd keep it MAX unless you are extremely experienced already and have run these dosages by themselves already.

    Feel free to ask or PM any questions. And as I say for anyone who is getting advice from someone (particularly a guy) on self-medication w/ controlled substances, ask why this or that stack and this or that dosage. If they don't have a good reason then go do your own research because they don't know what they are talking about and its YOUR body that will have to deal w/ the results AND the sides. Also note the effects of this stuff is cumulative -if you continue to do cycles after this it will all add up. Its really just way overkill. Also anything I say here is not to attack your coach, but to enable YOU to make good decisions about what YOU put in YOUR body. To keep it in perspective, most well-qualified doctors won't touch the subject of women & steroids, so why would you happily hand over such a decision to some guy who probably takes most of his steroid experience & knowledge from the "guys" context and knows nothing about a woman's body? It ain't especially rocket science, but it is YOUR body (and your moods, your endocrine system, your reproductive system, stress on your daily life and the time it takes for all this stuff to clear as well).
    Last edited by sassy69; 07-06-2014 at 04:04 PM.
    "The only way you can hurt the body is not use it. Inactivity is the killer and, remember, it's never too late."
    ~Jack Lalanne



  3. #3
    RX MEMBER nic902's Avatar
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    Great post, Sassy!

    Quote Originally Posted by sassy69 View Post
    My usual recommendations can be found in this stickie: http://forums.rxmuscle.com/showthrea...omen-amp-Drugs

    So is this is a 12 week cycle of that stuff stacked for FIGURE? LMAO @ creating Physique so women use less steroids.

    Here's my first thing if you aren't big enough for Figure, then take a year off and build so you are. IMO that's is something that gets lost w/ the creation of these other categories relative to the history of FBB - the bodybuilders put in the years of work before expecting to jump on stage, whereas a lot of the newer girls find coaches that will load them up w/ drugs so they can get on stage ASAP and frequently as opposed to just growing the damn muscle and allowing the body to accommodate it.

    OK sorry, went off on a rant, but I see it all the time. IMO that's just overkill for drugs and if you're not where you want to be for stage, then schedule a decent off-season and then pick a show that you are ready for.

    Here's how I look at stacks:

    First 6 weeks:
    200mg/week primo
    + 175 mg/week var (7days/week x 25mg/day )
    + 175 mg/week winstrol (7 days/week x 25mg/day)
    ----------------------
    550 mg/week (keep in mind 250 mg/week of test is HRT for men)

    Then for the remainign 6 weeks:
    200mg/week primo
    + 350 mg/week var (7days/week x 50mg/day )
    + 350 mg/week winstrol (7 days/week x 50mg/day)
    ----------------------
    900 mg/week (keep in mind 250 mg/week of test is HRT for men and a gram of test /week is usually the cap for most guys who cycle).

    So, yea, overkill.

    The 200 mg primo I don't have a big problem with but there's something to be said about finding the "sweet spot" in a cycle. I'm not getting too excited about this particular total for a 7 day period, but I'd rather suggest you look at primo (I assume you're talking injectable primo depot), in a 5 day inject schedule - I'd say 150 mg/primo E5D is still a bit stiff if you're stacking w/ other stuff, and I'd rather suggest you cap it at 100mg E5D.

    The var & primo - honestly there's NO REASON to jack it THAT FAR. I'd cap it at 20mg /day MAX for this stuff. IMO It is supporting the stronger primo. I'm also not sure you really need wintrol at all if your'e running primo. MAYBE the last 6 weeks at maybe 10 mg ED (oral) or 25mg (inject) E3D. I would also suggest you DROP the var at 7-10 days out instead of increasing it because many women retain water on it and that can screw up your dial-in to stage day big time. That least week you want to keep things as simple and consistent as possible so your body doesn't experience some change it can't assimilate and its first reaction is to hold water. I'd bet your coach would then throw in a shit ton of diuretics to deal w/ water that should've never even been there if the var wasnt' promoting it. More drugs doesn't fix what the other drugs are causing.

    Look at what you're stacking: You've run this stuff together before, but you didn't mention the dosages. Both primo & winstrol are androgenic - expect your hair to fall out, your voice to crack & deepen and your joints are going to tell you to go fuck yourself w/ the winstrol for that long and in that dosage. (And the obvious promotion of joint issues ...). I would also suggest your BP is going to be off the charts. Don't forget when we're talking about side effects , it isn't just the visual / androgenic stuff - it also beats on your endocrine system. I'd also venture that coming off this giant stack you're going to experience some fun depression as your hormones get back in order. (The whole effect is not unlike "That Time Of The Month". Regardless of how much of all this stuff you use, it's an aggressive stack so I'd also supplement w/ acidophilus to help prevent any yeast infections. I would also include some BP & cholesterol support like Cholest-off or a cheaper combo of red yeast rice + non-flushing niacin + 200 mg CoQ10. (You can google about OTC supps that help w/ high cholesterol & blood pressure to find details about this.)

    50 mg /day is massive massive massive overkill. The reason guys don't run orals for long periods of time is that the dosage they use can be very hard on the liver. The reason women don't sweat it so much is that the usual dosage is pretty small. 50-100 mg is a guy's dose. There's just no fucking reason a Figure competitor needs to take this much stuff.

    Proviron - shit w/ all this other stuff, particularly the winstrol, I can't imagine why you need to throw that on top too. The judges don't want peeled figure competitors and if your water isn't controlled by the time you hit stage, you're either not ready (carrying too much fat) or you really need to revisit your diet.

    Two other questions:

    1) Who is paying for this cycle? Primo ain't cheap and enough anavar to support, let's see: 7x25mgx6weeks + 7x50mgx6weeks = 3150 mg of var?

    2) Do you trust your source? Primo depot tends to be one of the most frequently faked compounds. Anavar as well - very easy to sub in dbols for var tabs. If it's a UGL cap, who the hell knows what is in it or how strong / not strong it is. If there's any chance whatever compounds you got from whoever, isn't what they say it is and in the advertised dosage, for a woman's endocrine system and relative levels of testosterone that can be a REALLY bad result. Unless you enjoy singing 1st alto for the East German Women's Choir and are very proud of your goatee. This is another reason we recommend very conservative doses for women. Steroids are not exactly an FDA approved, Quality Controlled and federally regulated distribution process. You are literally your very own petri dish.

    Whoever your coach is, he's pulling out all the tricks of a very seasoned FBB for this show. WAYYYY overkill. Please see the stickie I linked above. For women MORE isn't better. It just isn't. The dosages I outline in there are where I'd keep it MAX unless you are extremely experienced already and have run these dosages by themselves already.

    Feel free to ask or PM any questions. And as I say for anyone who is getting advice from someone (particularly a guy) on self-medication w/ controlled substances, ask why this or that stack and this or that dosage. If they don't have a good reason then go do your own research because they don't know what they are talking about and its YOUR body that will have to deal w/ the results AND the sides. Also note the effects of this stuff is cumulative -if you continue to do cycles after this it will all add up. Its really just way overkill. Also anything I say here is not to attack your coach, but to enable YOU to make good decisions about what YOU put in YOUR body. To keep it in perspective, most well-qualified doctors won't touch the subject of women & steroids, so why would you happily hand over such a decision to some guy who probably takes most of his steroid experience & knowledge from the "guys" context and knows nothing about a woman's body? It ain't especially rocket science, but it is YOUR body (and your moods, your endocrine system, your reproductive system, stress on your daily life and the time it takes for all this stuff to clear as well).

  4. #4
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    Thank you, sassy! I like to do my own research and after talking to him about what his plans are I wanted to get the opinions from some other females. I did take a good 9 months off before I even started to think about prep again so I have put on decent size that I am happy with. That is why I was really wondering if I needed all of these extra chemicals in my body to be happy with what I bring to the stage. I would rather do the minimal amount of anything to not be so harsh on my body (and my wallet). I'm also only 23 and would love to compete for a longer amount of time and like you said, it all accumulates.

    My last prep I only went up to 25mg/day for anavar and winnie and we stopped both 10 days out from the show.

    Sorry if any of this seems rambled, typing on my phone!

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    Super Moderator sassy69's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cfig91 View Post
    Thank you, sassy! I like to do my own research and after talking to him about what his plans are I wanted to get the opinions from some other females. I did take a good 9 months off before I even started to think about prep again so I have put on decent size that I am happy with. That is why I was really wondering if I needed all of these extra chemicals in my body to be happy with what I bring to the stage. I would rather do the minimal amount of anything to not be so harsh on my body (and my wallet). I'm also only 23 and would love to compete for a longer amount of time and like you said, it all accumulates.

    My last prep I only went up to 25mg/day for anavar and winnie and we stopped both 10 days out from the show.

    Sorry if any of this seems rambled, typing on my phone!
    If you have the size, then really the only thing you'd really be looking for the cycle to do is support muscle loss while you're dieting down. Really no need for all of this. And all the tricks that FBBs / BBs use for competition becomes more & more out of context w/ the requirements for Figure. If you cant' dial in primarily w/ diet and maybe some support drugs, then your'e not ready or there's something not optimized in your diet/training/recovery. Even if you choose to stack, the dosages I suggest in the stickie are very well sufficient.
    "The only way you can hurt the body is not use it. Inactivity is the killer and, remember, it's never too late."
    ~Jack Lalanne



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    IMO, cut doses in half....
    APS HI TECH PHARMACEUTICALS ATHLETE
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    Quote Originally Posted by tammyp View Post
    IMO, cut doses in half....

    LOL The short & sweet answer!
    "The only way you can hurt the body is not use it. Inactivity is the killer and, remember, it's never too late."
    ~Jack Lalanne



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