carbohydrate allocation

[The Solution]

Kevin
when you work 8-8 and your only option is to train upon waking before work all the time, that is my only option
I would rather get to the gym, get it done, then wait till 9 p.m. and try to rush before it closes at 10 p.m., just not going to happen, especially when i have to take care of chores, food prep etc... i just wont have time. Only time i can do it is if i wake my ass up and get it done, or else my conssitency and dedication would be complete chit.

[Steve56]

Kevin
when you work 8-8 and your only option is to train upon waking before work all the time, that is my only option
I would rather get to the gym, get it done, then wait till 9 p.m. and try to rush before it closes at 10 p.m., just not going to happen, especially when i have to take care of chores, food prep etc... i just wont have time. Only time i can do it is if i wake my ass up and get it done, or else my conssitency and dedication would be complete chit.

Just playing devils advocate here... Lets say u wake up at 5-6 am to train if u cant get a meal in at that time why not just down a whey iso shake with some powdered carbs then go train ... U look the best u ever have so what ur doing now is working but hey maybe this would give u even better results

[The Solution]

Just playing devils advocate here... Lets say u wake up at 5-6 am to train if u cant get a meal in at that time why not just down a whey iso shake with some powdered carbs then go train ... U look the best u ever have so what ur doing now is working but hey maybe this would give u even better results

Been there done that, tried it before and did not benefit from it, anything food / whey wise sits a bit heavy regardless of amount. This is another reason why i dont eat protein bars often, they mess with my stomach (maybe artificial sweeteners)

Seeing i train upon waking with BCAA's these settle much easier than a whey shake ever would prior to training hence why i have tried it, did not suit me, and used the BCAA pre/intra method (5g pre and 5g intra) and found success.

I also do not buy whey iso because its 1) made for lactose individuals and 2) expensive as chit. The majority who use it for "Digestion Speed" already for the most cases have food overlapping from a pre-workout or previous meal or 2 have aminos present in the bloodstream from an pre/inta bcaa product.

[bushmaster]

you make a really good point in here ,before i ever used aas or hrt if i trained without eating a meal 1.5 hours before or skipped a meal the day before i would notice a big energy drop and a big strength drop. gear does make a big diff. i believe bob is lifetime clean so i guess his body is different than mine was.

No once again you are all missing the point! You can't even say that's the same thing. You lost out on calories by missing that meal. Bob has all his carbs but at other times. Totally different.

You all are comparing apples and oranges. If you want to relate anything and make it relevant there can only be one variable changing.

[KevinCouch]

No once again you are all missing the point! You can't even say that's the same thing. You lost out on calories by missing that meal. Bob has all his carbs but at other times. Totally different.

You all are comparing apples and oranges. If you want to relate anything and make it relevant there can only be one variable changing.

Failure to communicate . I'm not saying that one can NOT train fasted overnight with success. What Phil and I have said was maybe Bob (being lifetime natty) would have more productive workouts if he had a pre and intra shake at the minimum in his system. Even with "enhanced" guys unless they have an abundant number of carbs before bed or late night they could very well be inhibiting their work some to training without the glycogen stores. I know you have said that the body stores glycogen overnight very efficiently and it may for some slower metabolizers but it doesn't work for me. Not trying to prove anyone in here wrong, just sharing my thoughts and experiences.

Bob has mentioned that he is unable to stomach whey protein or much of anything in the morning because of GI issues. I think he would still be better of even grabbing a banana is drinking a regular old gatoraid and take a few BCAA to get something in his system before training.

Not comparing apples to oranges. If Bob wanted to try this one variable would only be changed...Adding a pre and intra shake. The reason why I added "enhanced" athletes may very well train fasted with good results is because example of "Slin" allows for amino acids and glucose to be pushed into muscle cells, greatly stimulating muscle protein synthesis and good old fashion "Test" will repair muscle tissue much faster than the human body naturally can.

I woke up this morning weighing 191.2. Last night I went to bed weighing 194.7. You can say it's all water but I didn't take one trip to the bathroom.

We'll agree to just disagree....

[bushmaster]

It's all water. Pee or not your body consumes water. If it didn't you would continously gain weight every single day and be well over a thousand pounds by now.

But I will stop. It's hard to try and show others an alternative when they want to keep the blinders on. Keep doing what you are all doing.

[KevinCouch]

It's all water. Pee or not your body consumes water. If it didn't you would continously gain weight every single day and be well over a thousand pounds by now.

But I will stop. It's hard to try and show others an alternative when they want to keep the blinders on. Keep doing what you are all doing.

Just because someone doesn't agree with you on a certain subject now we (I) have blinders on?
I've laid out my reasons what has worked for me and the reasons why it may or may not work for others. I will keep doing what I'm doing.

[bushmaster]

Just because someone doesn't agree with you on a certain subject now we (I) have blinders on?
I've laid out my reasons what has worked for me and the reasons why it may or may not work for others. I will keep doing what I'm doing.

Kevin sorry but basic science escapes you. Water is devoid of calories for a reason. Look that up and you'll realize your statements of losing no water overnight makes no sense. You can take that as an insult if you wish but it is not.

I've laid out my reasons as well but arguing with someone who doesn't understand basic science and definitions is a waste of everyone's time. What you're doing works for you. Some of us aren't as blessed with genetics and have to learn and utilize much more.

[SideShowDoc]

Just because someone doesn't agree with you on a certain subject now we (I) have blinders on?
I've laid out my reasons what has worked for me and the reasons why it may or may not work for others. I will keep doing what I'm doing.

Bush is right on this matter kev, your body metabolizes and rids itself of oxygen by a ton of different route not just urination or bowel movements. Heck, even when you expire you are releasing some water with the air as well.

[KevinCouch]

Kevin sorry but basic science escapes you. Water is devoid of calories for a reason. Look that up and you'll realize your statements of losing no water overnight makes no sense. You can take that as an insult if you wish but it is not.

I've laid out my reasons as well but arguing with someone who doesn't understand basic science and definitions is a waste of everyone's time. What you're doing works for you. Some of us aren't as blessed with genetics and have to learn and utilize much more.

Trying to prove a point and twist my words?
NO! I didn't say you can't lose any water overnight or without urinating. I said it's not ALL water and some of it is glycogen stores as well over a period of 12 hours or so. Everything I laid out is true.

Your sitting here trying to say that I don't understand the human body and science and how it works....really? Yea I accomplished what I have by living off of my superior genetics and "basic science escapes me."

This all started when I asked Bob why he trained fasted overnight. I offered my advice as to it might help his workouts if he added at least a pre and intra shake. Then you try and get into a pissing match to show everyone that "science" behind glycogen. I responded by saying that there are other variables involved with "slin" and other compounds that would help one push glucose into the muscles stimulating protein synthesis for the enhanced BB. Then you go back to try and educate me on science of water....TELLING ME IT'S 100% WATER LOSS OVERNIGHT. I said it's not ALL water.

You obviously didn't read my post correctly and you missed the point, not me.

I don't take what you said as an insult but don't judge me or my intelligence ever! If you think I woke up one day and looked in the mirror and looked like this, you're seriously misinformed. I have busted my ass in the gym and I do know (probably as much or more) than most about how to use nutrition to manipulate the body to get the results I want. What I don't know is about all the compounds that are used today in BB. Nor do I want to. I don't judge anyone else in here or you so you don't go making these accusations about me.

[The Solution]

I stated I train with bcaa's 5g pre and intra
not sure how you did not pick up on that being the fastest form of protein shuttling and faster than whey pre

[KevinCouch]

I stated I train with bcaa's 5g pre and intra
not sure how you did not pick up on that being the fastest form of protein shuttling and faster than whey pre

Yes. I saw where you take BCAA pre and intra I know what BCAA are and what they do:
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"Bob has mentioned that he is unable to stomach whey protein or much of anything in the morning because of GI issues. I think he would still be better of even grabbing a banana is drinking a regular old gatoraid and take a few BCAA to get something in his system before training."
---------

I was stating that adding some carbs with the BCAAs would help like a banana or even a gatoraid.

Not sure why you didn't pick up on that Bob? In your own words..

You are coming across as a smart ass and all I was trying to do is offer you my thoughts on improving your training. I guess you know all there is to know about training and nutrition and need no help. That's all I've ever done is offer my input and advice to help others with my own successes and failures. I don't have all the answers but I've never steered anybody wrong.

[The Solution]

Yes. I saw where you take BCAA pre and intra I know what BCAA are and what they do:
--------
"Bob has mentioned that he is unable to stomach whey protein or much of anything in the morning because of GI issues. I think he would still be better of even grabbing a banana is drinking a regular old gatoraid and take a few BCAA to get something in his system before training."
---------

I was stating that adding some carbs with the BCAAs would help like a banana or even a gatoraid.

Not sure why you didn't pick up on that Bob? In your own words..

You are coming across as a smart ass and all I was trying to do is offer you my thoughts on improving your training. I guess you know all there is to know about training and nutrition and need no help. That's all I've ever done is offer my input and advice to help others with my own successes and failures. I don't have all the answers but I've never steered anybody wrong.

I saw that, but i have used a lot of intra-workout carbs in the past from various forms Kevin. WMS, Dextorse, Malto, HBCD, all do not really seem to merit much even when cutting/bulking. Regarding performance, endurance or changes in Recovery/Strength. I know a lot of people who do not benefit off intra-workout or pre-workout carb powders, some dwell better off just food alone, but again in the end the human body is too diverse to know what works for one and what works for another. For some it works, for some they do not respond well. Same could be said with various pre-workout products, and dieting/training methods. Everyone is always learning their body and learning new things about their training / cardio to what suits them best for their progress.

Again if Whey does not settle, eating a banana pre-workout wont aid much more with digestion especially since i am in the gym 10 minutes after i wake up. Some people can stomach a 600 kcal meal and train 5 minutes later, some need a good few hours (if i eat a pre-workout meal i need at least a good 2+ hours) even if its real light like 300-400 kcals prior to training to digest. Some people could eat a banana and then go pick up a weight.

I do not do protein shakes, i drink maybe one a year if that.

[KevinCouch]

I saw that, but i have used a lot of intra-workout carbs in the past from various forms Kevin. WMS, Dextorse, Malto, HBCD, all do not really seem to merit much even when cutting/bulking. Regarding performance, endurance or changes in Recovery/Strength. I know a lot of people who do not benefit off intra-workout or pre-workout carb powders, some dwell better off just food alone, but again in the end the human body is too diverse to know what works for one and what works for another. For some it works, for some they do not respond well. Same could be said with various pre-workout products, and dieting/training methods. Everyone is always learning their body and learning new things about their training / cardio to what suits them best for their progress.

Again if Whey does not settle, eating a banana pre-workout wont aid much more with digestion especially since i am in the gym 10 minutes after i wake up. Some people can stomach a 600 kcal meal and train 5 minutes later, some need a good few hours (if i eat a pre-workout meal i need at least a good 2+ hours) even if its real light like 300-400 kcals prior to training to digest. Some people could eat a banana and then go pick up a weight.

I do not do protein shakes, i drink maybe one a year if that.

I hear ya. I don't have a problem with you Bob. I was just trying to help as always. I have a problem with someone who insults me and my intelligence when they don't know me and know they couldn't hold a candle to me 365 days per year, even at my age.

I've never been disrespect to anyone and I never will be just the facts.

[lastson]

I do not do protein shakes, i drink maybe one a year if that.

But you use protein powders in all of your recipes ?

Do you have any digestive issues when using it in your baking ? If not do you think combining it with other ingredients helps or just allowing more time to digest is the key ?