Shawn Rhoden

**run4td** · 02-03-2015, 11:47 PM

Originally Posted by DAVEMADMAX6

Don't let this guy rattle you Brad. He just loves getting a reaction out of people.

Haha not rattled. I actually think he is one of the more intellectual posters on the boards. He may be controversial with what he posts but he is spot on at times and just exposes what most don't want to see or realize. Its much more entertaining than reading some of the childish banter from others.

Its just funny how secretive everything in this industry is. Everyother sport we know what contracts are, what terms are, and why relationships fail. Would be nice to see some of the facts come out about all the companies and athletes instead of speculation and the assumptions that occur.

**DAVEMADMAX6** · 02-03-2015, 11:59 PM

Originally Posted by run4td

Haha not rattled. I actually think he is one of the more intellectual posters on the boards. He may be controversial with what he posts but he is spot on at times and just exposes what most don't want to see or realize. Its much more entertaining than reading some of the childish banter from others.

Its just funny how secretive everything in this industry is. Everyother sport we know what contracts are, what terms are, and why relationships fail. Would be nice to see some of the facts come out about all the companies and athletes instead of speculation and the assumptions that occur.

Agreed. I am told that you may come along with Shawn and hang out at the Fit Expo? I hope so. Might get some cool footage for your channel.

**run4td** · 02-04-2015, 12:32 AM

Originally Posted by DAVEMADMAX6

Agreed. I am told that you may come along with Shawn and hang out at the Fit Expo? I hope so. Might get some cool footage for your channel.

I will be there. Not sure how long I am going to stay but going to go see some familiar faces. Wife will be there working all weekend so im sure I'll be there longer than I plan!

**Musclepapa John** · 02-04-2015, 09:37 AM

Originally Posted by run4td

Everyone wants to assume athletes either get clear cut dropped for lack of engagement or they are not "loyal" as some fans like to think. There is a business aspect behind everything.

The flip side or underbelly of some of these guys argument is that these exclusives are an attempt with select top placing open men bodybuilders to monopolize on their popularity. If the companies cannot convert on that popularity with guys like myself that they send out to do shoots the fans then blame the athlete.
Even as a top athlete I'd think from a business perspective a sponsoring company that offers you a one million dollar contract would expect to make ten million dollars or more from your association and if they aren't in a position to produce content that generates that income then they have to seriously consider not continuing to provide the athlete the one million dollar contract as it does nothing, but creates a loss for the sponsor. Why would any business essentially give someone a million dollar contract and then have to face struggling to merely break even on the transaction?
It has nothing to do with the worth of the athlete, but more to do with the value of the athlete at that time for the company.

**Musclepapa John** · 02-04-2015, 09:49 AM

Wonder how this fits into broader economic theories like supply side economics? If barriers and restrictions are lowered as with fewer "exclusive contracts" if there will be greater economic growth for the athlete and industry or if some barriers to competition and production are preferable?

**run4td** · 02-04-2015, 09:50 AM

Originally Posted by Musclepapa John

The flip side or underbelly of some of these guys argument is that these exclusives are an attempt with select top placing open men bodybuilders to monopolize on their popularity. If the companies cannot convert on that popularity with guys like myself that they send out to do shoots the fans then blame the athlete.
Even as a top athlete I'd think from a business perspective a sponsoring company that offers you a one million dollar contract would expect to make ten million dollars or more from your association and if they aren't in a position to produce content that generates that income then they have to seriously consider not continuing to provide the athlete the one million dollar contract as it does nothing, but creates a loss for the sponsor. Why would any business essentially give someone a million dollar contract and then have to face struggling to merely break even on the transaction?
It has nothing to do with the worth of the athlete, but more to do with the value of the athlete at that time for the company.

True, there needs to be a reasonable ROI with each business decision. What I was referring to was more along the lines of say company X decides they want athlete Y to compete multiple times in a year or they decide they want athlete Y to add another show weeks before they plan on competing. If the athlete doesn't comply even though all signs point to it negatively impacting the athletes performance or health they can be considered to be in breach of contract and dropped. Or athlete Y has in their contract that company X must pay for expenses for shows and when athlete Y submits expenses for a particular show company X decides they do not want to reimburse the athlete that is a breach on the companies part. I have seen both of these scenarios MANY times. This is the stuff that most people do not think about. There are so many little things in contracts and most athletes do not have an attorney/manager review the terms for them.

**Musclepapa John** · 02-04-2015, 09:56 AM

Enforcing those contracts with deep pocketed monolithic corporations is problematic. As an environmental activist with the Sierra Club (in another life lol)I was the chairman of our areas legislative and toxic issues division and while we would file lawsuits against companies regularly they would likewise file them against us personally. One category of suit is named SLAPP suits, Strategic Lawsuits Against Public Participation, which were typically developers basically with deep pockets filing suit against us individually to scare us off.
Point being, it takes time and money and who wants to file a suit against someone who is paying you whether they be an employer or sponsor as it destroys in likelihood of doing business with them again,...and in the end the business side of things is all about the money

Originally Posted by run4td

True, there needs to be a reasonable ROI with each business decision. What I was referring to was more along the lines of say company X decides they want athlete Y to compete multiple times in a year or they decide they want athlete Y to add another show weeks before they plan on competing. If the athlete doesn't comply even though all signs point to it negatively impacting the athletes performance or health they can be considered to be in breach of contract and dropped. Or athlete Y has in their contract that company X must pay for expenses for shows and when athlete Y submits expenses for a particular show company X decides they do not want to reimburse the athlete that is a breach on the companies part. I have seen both of these scenarios MANY times. This is the stuff that most people do not think about. There are so many little things in contracts and most athletes do not have an attorney/manager review the terms for them.

**guruhonza** · 02-04-2015, 11:32 AM

Czech amateur bodybuilder with supplement company as his sponsor HAD TO compete twice last year or he'd face 2,5k $ (50k czech koruna) fine for each show (1 or 2) he did not compete at. It was his contract obligation. Well... he prepped himself got sick 10 days before first show. And to make story short - he spent 2 weeks in hospital after second show lucky not to have kidney failure.

Some contracts are interesting =) I'm glad for Brad's previous post

**Musclepapa John** · 02-04-2015, 11:45 AM

Originally Posted by guruhonza

Czech amateur bodybuilder with supplement company as his sponsor HAD TO compete twice last year or he'd face 2,5k $ (50k czech koruna) fine for each show (1 or 2) he did not compete at. It was his contract obligation. Well... he prepped himself got sick 10 days before first show. And to make story short - he spent 2 weeks in hospital after second show lucky not to have kidney failure.

Some contracts are interesting =) I'm glad for Brad's previous post

Luis Santa had a similar issue forced under contract to compete while balancing other issues during military service. Cedric has faced some of the same I believe. To the tough go the rewards, but yeah we don't see the struggle of the athlete dealing with the corporate suits behind the scenes.

**gilbrt** · 02-04-2015, 12:02 PM

Originally Posted by run4td

True, there needs to be a reasonable ROI with each business decision. What I was referring to was more along the lines of say company X decides they want athlete Y to compete multiple times in a year or they decide they want athlete Y to add another show weeks before they plan on competing. If the athlete doesn't comply even though all signs point to it negatively impacting the athletes performance or health they can be considered to be in breach of contract and dropped. Or athlete Y has in their contract that company X must pay for expenses for shows and when athlete Y submits expenses for a particular show company X decides they do not want to reimburse the athlete that is a breach on the companies part. I have seen both of these scenarios MANY times. This is the stuff that most people do not think about. There are so many little things in contracts and most athletes do not have an attorney/manager review the terms for them.

Hey brad where can we find your vids on your website or on YouTube? And if so what's under on YouTube? Thanks just want to check out your vids .