article: Classic Physique; The Division of False Hope

[Tu Holmes]

Hey, I think many of the bikini girls look fantastic, and I give them MAJOR credit for prepping and getting onstage, but there are no bikini fans who are not competitors or friends/family of competitors. Sorry. It has popularity, yes. But not fans. Those are two very different things. I have followed this industry for over 10 years and have worked in it for 3, and I have never met one. I guess you could call the few guys that watch it for tits an ass fans... but not really. Find me a person who is a serious fan of the MPD or bikini who does not compete in that division, or is not related or close friends with a top competitor.

Do you think young kids have MPD guys on their walls in their bedrooms like we had Arnold and Ronnie on our walls? Not a chance.

I had posters of chicks on my wall. Samantha Fox and Kelly LeBrock to be specific.

Are you trying to tell us something?

[Geoff Roberts]

well clearly you know all about everything that is NPC/IFBB-I forgot you rule all and know more than anyone else on this board who is also in the midst of everything competitive and otherwise...oh forgive me great one for not seeing your vast knowledge on everything


please tell me, what else do you know for certain about the scene? no really...indulge me






but for the record, when I have competed my "fans" knew exactly who I was b/c of my competing

I'm not trying to offend you, I am simply stating what I have personally seen while being part of the industry. I have never once met a fan of bikini who was not a friend, family member, or competitor them self. I could be wrong, that is just what I have found.

I realize you have fans. I just feel that you would still have those fans if you did not compete because they are fans of your body, not your ability to compete against other girls.

[Geoff Roberts]

Hot movie stars don't have fans?

If all hot movie stars were wiped off the map, no one would care?

This doesn't make any sense.

Wow. I did not even come close to saying any of those things. So I am not sure how to answer you.

I said if bikini contests were wiped off the earth, all the hot bikini chicks would still have massive followings without competing because people are fans of their hotness, not how well they "compete". How you got "If all hot movie stars were wiped off the map, no one would care?" from that, I am not really sure.

[Tu Holmes]

Wow. I did not even come close to saying any of those things. So I am not sure how to answer you.

I said if bikini contests were wiped off the earth, all the hot bikini chicks would still have massive followings without competing because people are fans of their hotness, not how well they "compete". How you got "If all hot movie stars were wiped off the map, no one would care?" from that, I am not really sure.

Because YOU compared them to hot movie stars?

That's the comparison YOU made.

I didn't make it.

So if hot movie stars stopped making movies no one would care then?

Does that make it better for you?

[Geoff Roberts]

I had posters of chicks on my wall. Samantha Fox and Kelly LeBrock to be specific.

Are you trying to tell us something?

Not sure what you being exactly like every other guy in the world has to do with this discussion?

Your logic there, in regards to this discussion, implies you had those photos up because you aspired to one day be a hot pin up girl.

[Tu Holmes]

Not sure what you being exactly like every other guy in the world has to do with this discussion?

Your logic there, in regards to this discussion, implies you had those photos up because you aspired to one day be a hot pin up girl.

Now you're just deflecting.

You know exactly what I'm implying. I put people on the wall I think are hot and find attractive like most red blooded american males. As you said, like every other guy in the world.

You putting up pictures of oiled up men on your walls says something about you I think.

Deflection is unbecoming.

[~gymdiva~]

I'm not trying to offend you, I am simply stating what I have personally seen while being part of the industry. I have never once met a fan of bikini who was not a friend, family member, or competitor them self. I could be wrong, that is just what I have found.

and that is what I'm ultimately looking for-making a sweeping statement of fact based on something you've seen or have not seen is not responsible-had you used the "in my opinion" disclaimer I probably would have said nothing

I realize you have fans. I just feel that you would still have those fans if you did not compete because they are fans of your body, not your ability to compete against other girls.

this is an interesting area-did I gain some fans while competing? sure -did they all stay with me? no -why? well, some it's just a matter of moving on to the next thing...the next competitor that catches their attention-out of sight, out of mind as they say...now, did some stay b/c of how I looked (mainly my calves, who am I kidding) and the answer is yes

that's the true nature of competing...people stay fans of competitors for their own reasons...and these fans range from the average teenager to the housewife to the phD earner to the fellow competitors of all levels and categories...there is no one way to categorize this no matter how much some may want to

[Geoff Roberts]

Because YOU compared them to hot movie stars?

That's the comparison YOU made.

I didn't make it.

So if hot movie stars stopped making movies no one would care then?

Does that make it better for you?

I compared them in regards to them being popular because of how they look. It was a bad example, and 1 line of about 200. I apologize for using an inaccurate analogy that you fixated on because you are unable refute my main points in any other way.

[Tu Holmes]

and that is what I'm ultimately looking for-making a sweeping statement of fact based on something you've seen or have not seen is not responsible-had you used the "in my opinion" disclaimer I probably would have said nothing




this is an interesting area-did I gain some fans while competing? sure -did they all stay with me? no -why? well, some it's just a matter of moving on to the next thing...the next competitor that catches their attention-out of sight, out of mind as they say...now, did some stay b/c of how I looked (mainly my calves, who am I kidding) and the answer is yes

that's the true nature of competing...people stay fans of competitors for their own reasons...and these fans range from the average teenager to the housewife to the phD earner to the fellow competitors of all levels and categories...there is no one way to categorize this no matter how much some may want to

It doesn't really matter WHY they are fans... they are FANS none the less.

To say otherwise is just being disingenuous.

[Tu Holmes]

I compared them in regards to them being popular because of how they look. It was a bad example, and 1 line of about 200. I apologize for using an inaccurate analogy that you fixated on because you are unable refute my main points in any other way.

You haven't really made any "points".

All you've done is say some random thoughts about what YOU think.

They aren't points, they are as ~gymdiva~ said, opinions.

Nothing special about them what so ever.

[Geoff Roberts]

Now you're just deflecting.

You know exactly what I'm implying. I put people on the wall I think are hot and find attractive like most red blooded american males. As you said, like every other guy in the world.

You putting up pictures of oiled up men on your walls says something about you I think.

Deflection is unbecoming.

My point was that nobody has bikini or MPD posters on their wall because they aspire to be like them. On the other hand, pretty much every successful bodybuilder ever had Arnold and the like posters on their walls because they wanted to look like them.

I know what you were implying, but you don't. You were implying that pretty much every single bodybuilder ever is gay. Good call.

[Geoff Roberts]

You haven't really made any "points".

All you've done is say some random thoughts about what YOU think.

They aren't points, they are as ~gymdiva~ said, opinions.

Nothing special about them what so ever.

Experiences, not opinions.

[Tu Holmes]

Experiences, not opinions.

Sounds like you should try to have more experiences. Mine have been the opposite. I see tons of people flock around bikini competitors at the O and the Arnold.

I find it odd you talking negatively about people generating fans regarding how they "look" when EVERY SINGLE person on an NPC or IFBB stage is generating fans based upon how they look.

That is pot / kettle.

[Geoff Roberts]

and that is what I'm ultimately looking for-making a sweeping statement of fact based on something you've seen or have not seen is not responsible-had you used the "in my opinion" disclaimer I probably would have said nothing




this is an interesting area-did I gain some fans while competing? sure -did they all stay with me? no -why? well, some it's just a matter of moving on to the next thing...the next competitor that catches their attention-out of sight, out of mind as they say...now, did some stay b/c of how I looked (mainly my calves, who am I kidding) and the answer is yes

that's the true nature of competing...people stay fans of competitors for their own reasons...and these fans range from the average teenager to the housewife to the phD earner to the fellow competitors of all levels and categories...there is no one way to categorize this no matter how much some may want to

I hear ya. I meant no disrespect. As a physique athlete, I would think you would be happy with my theory that people are fans of what you have built, not how it compares to others onstage and what judges think based on subjectivity. In no way am I bashing the bikini competitors. I am questioning the popularity of the actual shows themselves based on what I have seen.

[Geoff Roberts]

Sounds like you should try to have more experiences. Mine have been the opposite. I see tons of people flock around bikini competitors at the O and the Arnold.

I find it odd you talking negatively about people generating fans regarding how they "look" when EVERY SINGLE person on an NPC or IFBB stage is generating fans based upon how they look.

That is pot / kettle.

I never said people do not flock to them at shows, I said they do not really care about the actual competition.

I never said (sensing a trend here?) that bikini girls being popular just via their looks was a negative thing.

Yes everyone is judged on what they look like. My point was tons of people are very excited to see Kai compete against Compton. They are far more exited to watch them compete than to look at their photos on Instagram. Whereas in bikini I have found the opposite to be true.

Stop twisting my words. We are having a good discussion, gymdiva is defending herself just fine, we do not need your verbal diarrhea.