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  1. #1
    RX MEMBER sy2502's Avatar
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    Default Agonizing over losing natty status

    Hello, I am 43 years old and have been BBing for 6 years. I am currently natty and competing in both natural federations and NPC. I have placed top 3 in some class or other in all the competitions I have done, regardless of the federation. The last competition was NPC, I worked my ass off, really really worked hard, and it hit my self esteem to see how much far ahead some of the other girls were compared to me. I am starting to think of enhancements, but I am very conflicted about it. As I said, I work very hard so I am not looking for shortcuts to make up for a bad diet and lazy training. But it's turning out to be a very very hard decision for me to make. I have no close friends in BBing to discuss this, and I really need some help.

    I wonder if any of you ladies has felt so emotional about losing nattyness?

    Here's the pros and cons I can see

    Cons:
    - Won't be able to compete in natty federations anymore.
    - I know several friends see me as inspirational for competing natty against non natty, and I feel like I betray them.
    - If my hubby knew I was taking anything, a nuclear explosion would be nothing compared to his reaction.
    - Cost.

    *** I am not including health issues because I was planning on sticking with SARMS for the foreseeable future. ***

    Pros:
    - I love muscle. LOVE IT. I love muscle, definition, vascularity, the works!
    - I am in my 40s, I feel I don't have much time left before Father Time starts working against me. It's now or never.

    I hope you don't think I am stupid in agonizing so much over this, but feel free to tell me I am

  2. #2
    OLYMPIAN Sunnyday's Avatar
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    I've battled with the same: same pros and cons as you. Decided to stay natty no matter what. I started seriously training in 2010 and competing in figure in 2011 at age 43. Yeah, I worked myself senseless and watched a few place higher, it sucks. But you might find that even with some chemical "help" the others will still place above you. Ask yourself how you would feel if that happened? Personally I had to admit I'd regret losing my natty status if my placing didn't change after taking the chemical plunge.

    At 48 I've learned what it takes to dial in my diet and training for MY body, my husband says I've "totally hulked out", and I'd say I've gained enough muscle that I'd be told by the natty federations that I've got too much muscle for figure (don't compete currently due to cost). Honestly I look better now than ever, leaner AND more muscle than ever, and I'm never tempted anymore with the idea of taking something on anybody's banned substsnce list. Oh, and I'm STILL GROWING - HA!!

    So don't think you can't build muscle because of your age.
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  3. #3
    RX MEMBER sy2502's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sunnyday View Post
    I've battled with the same: same pros and cons as you. Decided to stay natty no matter what. I started seriously training in 2010 and competing in figure in 2011 at age 43. Yeah, I worked myself senseless and watched a few place higher, it sucks. But you might find that even with some chemical "help" the others will still place above you. Ask yourself how you would feel if that happened? Personally I had to admit I'd regret losing my natty status if my placing didn't change after taking the chemical plunge.

    At 48 I've learned what it takes to dial in my diet and training for MY body, my husband says I've "totally hulked out", and I'd say I've gained enough muscle that I'd be told by the natty federations that I've got too much muscle for figure (don't compete currently due to cost). Honestly I look better now than ever, leaner AND more muscle than ever, and I'm never tempted anymore with the idea of taking something on anybody's banned substsnce list. Oh, and I'm STILL GROWING - HA!!

    So don't think you can't build muscle because of your age.
    Thank you so much for your comment, good to know it's not just me going through this. I also do very well in natty competitions, and just like you I am at the limit of size for Figure. Then I go to NPC and I feel like "do I even lift?", with Bikini girls bigger than me LOL.
    As you said, being enhanced is no guarantee of winning, after all in NPC shows plenty girls are enhanced, but only one wins, so that alone is no magic bullet. That's why I didn't put "winning an NPC show" in the "pros", because I know it's not a free ticket to the top. I am also still making progress year to year, at every competition I look better than the last, it's just not "that" look, if you know what I mean, that full, shrink wrapped look that natties just can't get.
    Anyway thank you so much for your reply, I hope to hear from others too what their experience is.

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    OLYMPIAN Sunnyday's Avatar
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    Oh, I don't know, I was pretty shrink wrapped and had lines in my glutes for 2011 OCB Yorton Cup Nationals and at 8 days out on seeing my back, Dave Pulcinella (my coach) said, "Your back looks retarded!!" I hadn't even begun drying out when he made that comment.

    http://www.photoreflect.com/store/Orderpage.aspx?pi=0SKV002J0S0070&po=70&pc=521

    http://www.photoreflect.com/store/Or...0&po=60&pc=521

    Not sure if those links work so...

    Lines in the obliques at 3 weeks out of the above show...

    image.jpg
    ^not shown, but I had lines in my pecs too.


    NPC would say I'm too lean for figure and need to soften up but I can't rock that soft look and always did better at shows where a hard, grainy look is awarded. BTW, I was 103 lbs at that show and I placed 2nd in the open and in masters. Five years later, I'm rocking the same leanness as the pink bikini pic above (right now as I write this) at a BW of 110, side serratus looks like a cheese grater, can clearly see the lat tie-ins from armpit all the way to the hip, veiny abs, added 3" on my shoulders, 3" on my thighs, back pic in my avi was 2015 with noticeable improvement in thickness over the 2011 pics, same waist as in 2011.

    I could easily take 3 weeks from today and achieve an even more full, shrink-wrapped look than the above stage pics, and with only a mild dry-out with a little over-watering.

    That full, shrink-wrapped look CAN be achieved as a natty. I am sure I'm not the only one because I've seen the women who beat me at those shows. It takes time but it is 100% achievable.
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  5. #5
    RX MEMBER sy2502's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sunnyday View Post
    Oh, I don't know, I was pretty shrink wrapped and had lines in my glutes for 2011 OCB Yorton Cup Nationals and at 8 days out on seeing my back, Dave Pulcinella (my coach) said, "Your back looks retarded!!" I hadn't even begun drying out when he made that comment.

    http://www.photoreflect.com/store/Orderpage.aspx?pi=0SKV002J0S0070&po=70&pc=521

    http://www.photoreflect.com/store/Or...0&po=60&pc=521

    Not sure if those links work so...

    Lines in the obliques at 3 weeks out of the above show...

    image.jpg
    ^not shown, but I had lines in my pecs too.


    NPC would say I'm too lean for figure and need to soften up but I can't rock that soft look and always did better at shows where a hard, grainy look is awarded. BTW, I was 103 lbs at that show and I placed 2nd in the open and in masters. Five years later, I'm rocking the same leanness as the pink bikini pic above (right now as I write this) at a BW of 110, side serratus looks like a cheese grater, can clearly see the lat tie-ins from armpit all the way to the hip, veiny abs, added 3" on my shoulders, 3" on my thighs, back pic in my avi was 2015 with noticeable improvement in thickness over the 2011 pics, same waist as in 2011.

    I could easily take 3 weeks from today and achieve an even more full, shrink-wrapped look than the above stage pics, and with only a mild dry-out with a little over-watering.

    That full, shrink-wrapped look CAN be achieved as a natty. I am sure I'm not the only one because I've seen the women who beat me at those shows. It takes time but it is 100% achievable.
    Wow, you do look pretty amazing! How many weeks prep did it take you? I got leaner than ever for my last show but lost more muscle than I ever did in a prep, which is a pain because it takes months to gain, and days to lose LOL.

  6. #6
    OLYMPIAN Sunnyday's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sy2502 View Post
    Wow, you do look pretty amazing! How many weeks prep did it take you? I got leaner than ever for my last show but lost more muscle than I ever did in a prep, which is a pain because it takes months to gain, and days to lose LOL.
    That was an 11-week prep, the most I did was 40 min of cardio 5 days per week. Calories were kept near 2,000. I'm 5'2". I've never prepped more than 12 weeks and never had to do that much cardio again.

    I agree with you, the muscle loss is rough! For a natty it really comes down to keeping cardio to a minumum and finding the right type of cardio for your own body. That's what I mean about the time: you'll need to experiment but once you find that sweet spot you won't have to cardio-off your hard-earned muscle and you'll be mopping the floor with your competition.
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  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by sy2502 View Post
    - If my hubby knew I was taking anything, a nuclear explosion would be nothing compared to his reaction.
    That's a huge red flag right there. Even if you just dabble in SARMs it would be best to be up front with him about it. You might be able to sneak around for a while and get away with it but it's pretty easy to slip up. Plus, what if they actually work and you start breaking through a plateau that you've never been able to break through before? Your husband will be the first to notice. Talk with him ahead of time or don't do it.

  8. #8
    RX MEMBER sy2502's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EdwardBoen View Post
    That's a huge red flag right there. Even if you just dabble in SARMs it would be best to be up front with him about it. You might be able to sneak around for a while and get away with it but it's pretty easy to slip up. Plus, what if they actually work and you start breaking through a plateau that you've never been able to break through before? Your husband will be the first to notice. Talk with him ahead of time or don't do it.

    Yes, I understand what you mean. Having been with him almost 25 years, it bothers me not to be upfront on this. On the other hand, I don't expect SARMS to turn me into a beast in 12 weeks, so since he doesn't know much about BBing, other than what he learns through me, hopefully I can pass whatever gains as results of my hard work.
    Thank you for bringing this side to the discussion, I really appreciate.

  9. #9
    OLYMPIAN baby muscle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sy2502 View Post
    Yes, I understand what you mean. Having been with him almost 25 years, it bothers me not to be upfront on this. On the other hand, I don't expect SARMS to turn me into a beast in 12 weeks, so since he doesn't know much about BBing, other than what he learns through me, hopefully I can pass whatever gains as results of my hard work.
    Thank you for bringing this side to the discussion, I really appreciate.
    I also, believe that if you can't be honest/have to sneak substances by your partner, it's not worth doing or at least needs to have had a discussion about. It has possible legal implications for them as well.

    I'm not sure I believe SARMS keep you "natty" btw. But then again, I'm philosophical about just "what exactly is natty"? Is HRT natty? Only for women? How about insulin for diabetics or cortisone for Addison's patients? It's all hormone replacement, after all...some is essential for living, some is the essential component of gender...food for thought.
    Last edited by baby muscle; 08-04-2016 at 04:19 PM.

  10. #10
    RX MEMBER sy2502's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by baby muscle View Post
    I also, believe that if you can't be honest/have to sneak substances by your partner, it's not worth doing or at least needs to have had a discussion about. It has possible legal implications for them as well.

    I'm not sure I believe SARMS keep you "natty" btw. But then again, I'm philosophical about just "what exactly is natty"? Is HRT natty? Only for women? How about insulin for diabetics or cortisone for Addison's patients? It's all hormone replacement, after all...some is essential for living, some is the essential component of gender...food for thought.
    What legal implications are you referring to? I thought SARMS were legal. Although who knows for how long, since our government doesn't like us having anything shiny

    I wouldn't dream of considering myself natty after taking SARMS. I am not very good with figuring out the deeper issues like the ones you mentioned, but having competed natty in natty shows, I think I'd be pissed if a lady sneaked in having taken SARMS, so I wouldn't do it myself. I don't know if that means I'm not too smart, probably there already are and don't get caught.

    Anyway it's been a month since my competition, I am still working on normalizing my appetite and food intake, I think I wouldn't be getting all my money's worth if I took SARMS with a crappy diet. Surprisingly I only gained 5lbs since competition. I say surprisingly because if you saw the amount of chocolate, ice cream, and wine I have been eating and drinking, you'd probably be all revolted LOL.

    PS: oh heck who am I kidding? I am just procrastinating my decision.
    Last edited by sy2502; 08-04-2016 at 04:53 PM.

  11. #11
    OLYMPIAN baby muscle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sy2502 View Post
    What legal implications are you referring to? I thought SARMS were legal. Although who knows for how long, since our government doesn't like us having anything shiny

    I wouldn't dream of considering myself natty after taking SARMS. I am not very good with figuring out the deeper issues like the ones you mentioned, but having competed natty in natty shows, I think I'd be pissed if a lady sneaked in having taken SARMS, so I wouldn't do it myself. I don't know if that means I'm not too smart, probably there already are and don't get caught.

    Anyway it's been a month since my competition, I am still working on normalizing my appetite and food intake, I think I wouldn't be getting all my money's worth if I took SARMS with a crappy diet. Surprisingly I only gained 5lbs since competition. I say surprisingly because if you saw the amount of chocolate, ice cream, and wine I have been eating and drinking, you'd probably be all revolted LOL.

    PS: oh heck who am I kidding? I am just procrastinating my decision.
    I was referring to the legal issues w/ gear, not SARMS. You mentioned SARMS further down the thread but originally was just "losing natty status".

  12. #12
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    STAY NATTY. I can't stress this enough. I did not. I went the whole way. For what? Yes, I have a pro card. That's it. At the end of the day what does it mean?

    In this life you are competing against YOURSELF.

    It doesn't matter who you are. At age 75 we all have wrinkles. We all move slower. We all are more tired. ALL OF US. Whether we lived a healthy lifestyle or not. Whether we did steroids or not. Whether we got a degree or not. S

    Do you really think on your deathbed you will think "Wow I'm glad I did steroids because I placed top 3 instead of top 5!" You won't.

    Once you do them you can't go back.

    Unless you feel you are the genetically elite that can really make a living at this sport don't do it. And at this point you would know if you were genetically elite.

    Perhaps get into a sport where performance counts. Mentally if you can improve a lift or a time you feel more satisfied and accomplished. In bodybuilding it's all about placings and beyond your control. You might look like crap one show and place high. You might look great at another and place low. It's all dependant and can be very frustrating.

    And keeping a secret from your husband is just bad news. You don't want to do that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sy2502 View Post
    What legal implications are you referring to? I thought SARMS were legal. Although who knows for how long, since our government doesn't like us having anything shiny
    SARMS would be considered 'gray market' at best. The 'research chemical' fig leaf really doesn't make them legal. Same goes for peptides and other ancillaries sold as research chemicals.

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    Mar-Tan.com The_Waylon's Avatar
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    hair on your butt and a carrot clit....
    doesn't really bother me, but I am jaded by this industry lol

  15. #15
    Mar-Tan.com The_Waylon's Avatar
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    Oh wow...

    You should inbox me, for scientific reasons, obviously

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