Keto diet + prohormones = WTF?

[gottabecool]

Been back on the same Keto I lost 30lbs on earlier this year (In 10 weeks). Since adding in the PH's I have gained 16lbs back...and it is not all water/muscle. I had a real light (For me) refeed on Saturday which was week one, and here it is Wednesday and according to the strips, which I didn't even have before, I am still not in ketosis and I don't feel that good.


Anyways, is this a result of the drugs? Maybe changing my insulin sensitivity?
I was hoping the cycle would preserve some mass while I lost more weight, but I am going the other damn way.

[gottabecool]

BTW, cycle contains
H-drol @ 75mg
Fura @ 450mg
11-sterone @ 450mg
Cycle assist @ 10/day
Primal Male @ 4/day

[Curt James]

Someone posted a link somewhere that offered that if you're urinating frequently (from drinking that gallon of water per day) then the ketostix may not reveal anything other than a negative response while you're actually in ketosis.



I read elsewhere that it can take a few weeks for your body to shift, so if you're expecting to be in ketosis with one week on the diet I'm not sure that's a realistic expectation.

I've been on Dave's diet (as outlined in the S.M.A.R.T. course) for several weeks. No loss initially, but did see a drop for this past Saturday's weigh-in.

I also have the ketostix and have never seen a change in color.

Can you post your diet?

[gottabecool]

Someone posted a link somewhere that offered that if you're urinating frequently (from drinking that gallon of water per day) then the ketostix may not reveal anything other than a negative response while you're actually in ketosis.



I read elsewhere that it can take a few weeks for your body to shift, so if you're expecting to be in ketosis with one week on the diet I'm not sure that's a realistic expectation.

I've been on Dave's diet (as outlined in the S.M.A.R.T. course) for several weeks. No loss initially, but did see a drop for this past Saturday's weigh-in.

I also have the ketostix and have never seen a change in color.

Can you post your diet?

I understand that, but the first piss in the morning not showing was a little of a shock...Mid day, way more understandable.
My first two weeks before was no results, then BAM!

My concern is I am going the other direction, by alot.

Diet is fairly simple, typical day:

Meal 1: 50g Isolate shake, 18g of fat worth of nuts (Today was cashews)

Meal 2: 50g of protein from a lean meat (Ground turkey, chicken, buffalo, etc), 18g of fat from Mac nut oil.

Meal 3: typically the same as Meal 2, but I melt cheese on it for my fat.

Meal 4: 50g isolate shake, 18g of fat from mac nut oil

Meal 5: ~45-50g of protein from Salmon, the rest of my needed fat coming from shaved almonds and a little mac nut oil baked on top

GYM: 20g of BCAA's, either LG sciences or Chain'd out

Meal 6: 50g of Casein with 18g of fat from natty PB


Yes, I know Dave recommends against the intra-workout BCAA's. But this exact same plan worked for me before, the only difference is PH's.

[J2jud]

It shouldn't be the pro-hormones, but the general crappy feeling may be due to some lethargy and not getting enough carbs. To combat the lethargy take 50-100mg of DHEA with breakfast.

Going into ketosis will sometimes take two weeks. At least, that's been my experience with the diet and a few others I know. The refeed shouldn't take place until the 15th day of keto dieting or sometimes may be extended to the 22nd day.

[•P®øD¶G¥•]

Someone posted a link somewhere that offered that if you're urinating frequently (from drinking that gallon of water per day) then the ketostix may not reveal anything other than a negative response while you're actually in ketosis.



I read lsewhere that it can take a few weeks for your body to shift, so if you're expecting to be in ketosis with one week on the diet I'm not sure that's a realistic expectation.

True, because piss might too diluted, but Ketostix lie in more than one situation, I haven't eaten any kind of carbs(100% animals) for 13 months and when I piss on them, they don't budge, but one week is more than enough assuming you follow a protocol that allows you to do so.

Meal 1: 50g Isolate shake, 18g of fat worth of nuts (Today was cashews)

Meal 2: 50g of protein from a lean meat (Ground turkey, chicken, buffalo, etc), 18g of fat from Mac nut oil.

Meal 3: typically the same as Meal 2, but I melt cheese on it for my fat.

Meal 4: 50g isolate shake, 18g of fat from mac nut oil

Meal 5: ~45-50g of protein from Salmon, the rest of my needed fat coming from shaved almonds and a little mac nut oil baked on top

GYM: 20g of BCAA's, either LG sciences or Chain'd out

Meal 6: 50g of Casein with 18g of fat from natty PB

If you want to get in ketosis/low carb mode faster after a refeed or anytime, do this:

-Avoid any protein shakes, amino acids, etc.... since protein can be converted to glucose at a ratio of 48 or 52%, one of the two, I suspect the more proccessed and liquid the protein is the more it can hurt, lean meats & eggs only. The only thing I would allow would be a pre-W/O drink since the transitioning from carbs to fat is usually when people feel the shittiest and you don't wanna have sub-optimal performance.

-Do a PSMF (Protein Sparring modified fast) for 2-3 days then go back to a keto-diet, don't bother with the 6-10gs of fish oil since it's short term, I've been on it for 60 days without the fishoil, it does nothing for fat loss or performance from my observations. Fish oil in general is really not that important if carbs and omega 6 fatty acids are zero/low in your diet(mine is).

-Do light, low intensity exercise. You can go to the gym/house get an olympic bar or calisthenics and just do an insane amount of reps, full body for 1 hour, walk, run, clean your house, yard work, etc.....

Pros:

-Get in ketosis/low insulin mode faster.

-Faster Results & Feeling good seeing the calipers, scale, pics, etc... move when you test once a week.

-Relief from bloating, water retention and all that nasty shit.

Cons:

-Feeling tired for the transition from one extreme(refeed) to another (PSMF) (although like I said, a Pre-WO drink or ECA (20-25/200/81) will almost eliminate this.

-Feeling Hungry, binging, etc.... (If this is the case, either use ECA for appetite surpression or stop doing it, if you cannot adhere to a diet strategy there is no reason to do it half-assed and get half-assed results, do whatever plan you can follow 100%)

-Might feel weaker after doing the high rep/cardio W/Os and it might affect your main sport(weights?) depending on how much you do. When I ate carbs, it would take me 3-4 days with a PSMF, (throw 2 normal days of heavy power/olympic lifting and and an extra hour or 2 everyday for the 3-4 days I'm on the PSMF) just to get back to a carb depleted state and I always felt that it there was still some of that nasty refeed food in me though.

Again a pre-WO or ECA stak will take care of this too, If you're willing to use either, I think this is a good strategy.

I like Jack3d by USP labs (only other pre-wo supps I ever tried were Xtend watermelon, tasted great did nothing and the 5 hour energy shots in gas stations, these work pretty good.

Ephedrine can be bought as Bronkaid from Walgreens, CVS, Amazon.com, etc... with a driver's license only and Amazon.com doesn't need one I think. They come in 60 caps, you can buy 2, maybe 3 boxes total in a month, if you buy more from different places, the feds might be on your ass.

All these places also sell caffeine 200mg and Aspirin 81mg.

[gottabecool]

Thanks for joining in guys, but I think I was mis-understood...The diet shouldn't be the problem, as it worked REALLY well just 2 months ago for me.

The only change is the drugs.

Guess I need to dig deeper, maybe something I am missing....

[gottabecool]

LOL...I can't rep any you guys again yet. LOL