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  1. #16
    The Fitness View Carolyn Bryant's Avatar
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    Has anyone read "Chemical Pink" by Katie Arnoldi? It's a fabulous book if you want to know about drug cycles for women or first-hand discussion about a women lured into drug use and the regrets that followed.

    Fear is an illusion. Why be afraid to discuss something you are proud of doing?

    I know lots of women who have explored drugs, and more than few wish they had never gone there. The negatives outweighed the positives.

    Yes, I do consider some forms of bodybuilding to be self-mutilation.

    Thanks, Tayana for pointing out the info about Winstrol.

    I think the reason Leigh wrote the article was an attempt to educate and open up discussion. My comments are based on the discussions real people have about the subject but are reluctant to say because of a threat of being censored. So I ask again, why would any woman consider adding testosterone to her drug cocktail?

    Mr. Sledge, are you a doctor of some sort? Even if you were you would be considered godly if you claim to have some greater understaning of the intricate female endocrine system than a biochemist or me, for that matter because I am a woman. And a walking lab rat who can talk about personal experiences. What drugs do you use to stop your period? I think Danazol is wonderful and plan to write an article about it. There are far less side affects than the more common HRT's prescribed. Birth control pills worked well at first but later proved counterproductive during contest prep.

    I am Captain-Sav-a-Hoe in the flesh. But I only save those who want to be saved.

  2. #17
    Digital Marketing Manager, Team GAT SallyAnne's Avatar
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    Chemical Pink is your go to book for reference to fbb's AAS cycles? L O L.

  3. #18
    Super Moderator sassy69's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sledge View Post
    Isn't the main reason it's considered one of the safer ones for women because it's out of the system relatively fast. So if a woman starts to experience negative side effects she can just stop using the substance. Unlike primo which though IMO is safer for women but if you don't like the side effects and you stop using it today you still continue to experience the side efects for a few weeks after.

    Personaly i think Var and maybe primo are all any woman should need, but thats realy up to the individual woman to decide based on the positive side effects outweighing the negative in her mind. If a woman wants to run a long acting test and she know's what she's doing then more power to her. But I'd certainly understand her reluctance to talk about it with some of the rude oppinionated people out there.
    People like it because its easy to get & cheaper than var or primo, fast-acting / clears quickly, great for promoting tight, lean muscles. I also think there are many women who start their exposure to steroids by either seeing their bf/SO/husband using and wondering what it will do for them. I think many men know there is a difference between what they can take and what women should take, but aren't sure what. So they suggest winstrol because it is something they are familiar with, probably know where to get / have and its not an aggressive androgenic like the stuff guys use. And that's how it starts.. "Try some winny - it will lean you out & tone you up". And as Leigh notes, yes you can drink the winny instead of injecting because its water-based.

    I also think that after all that, women find one result or the other - they love it or hate it, probably based partially on their expectations / tolerance of sides, and then their particular body chemistry.
    "The only way you can hurt the body is not use it. Inactivity is the killer and, remember, it's never too late."
    ~Jack Lalanne



  4. #19
    Super Moderator sassy69's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SallyAnne View Post
    I think the reason many women don't talk about it is because of comments like the one you made. Our women's forum is here as a setting for women to be able to discuss difficult subjects like this without the fear of negative comments.

    ..and if you are proud of the fact that you are "a professional shyt starter", consider this a warning that you won't be starting it here.
    This is just another flavor of everything about what women do & whether or not they are "feminine". In most cases why they even bother bringing it up if the same old discussion/attitude/accusations/assumption always follows? The stigma around steroids in general makes it not worth calling attention to. Within the fitness community, every time someone comments on whether or not a female looks feminine or not blows up into a whole multipage debate thread, but no one says a thing if she does look feminine, even if she is using steroids. Its all very subjective and always sparks controversy so why would anyone want to call attention to it?
    "The only way you can hurt the body is not use it. Inactivity is the killer and, remember, it's never too late."
    ~Jack Lalanne



  5. #20
    Digital Marketing Manager, Team GAT SallyAnne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sassy69 View Post
    This is just another flavor of everything about what women do & whether or not they are "feminine". In most cases why they even bother bringing it up if the same old discussion/attitude/accusations/assumption always follows? The stigma around steroids in general makes it not worth calling attention to. Within the fitness community, every time someone comments on whether or not a female looks feminine or not blows up into a whole multipage debate thread, but no one says a thing if she does look feminine, even if she is using steroids. Its all very subjective and always sparks controversy so why would anyone want to call attention to it?
    As usual, I agree with you 100%.

    Leigh Penman is not writing her articles as a way of opening the age old debate on 'fuckability' and steroids. She's writing her articles for educational purposes and to hopefully encourage women to be more open about AAS usage.

  6. #21
    PENCILNECK Tatyana's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carolyn Bryant View Post
    Has anyone read "Chemical Pink" by Katie Arnoldi? It's a fabulous book if you want to know about drug cycles for women or first-hand discussion about a women lured into drug use and the regrets that followed.

    Fear is an illusion. Why be afraid to discuss something you are proud of doing?

    I know lots of women who have explored drugs, and more than few wish they had never gone there. The negatives outweighed the positives.

    Yes, I do consider some forms of bodybuilding to be self-mutilation.

    Thanks, Tayana for pointing out the info about Winstrol.

    I think the reason Leigh wrote the article was an attempt to educate and open up discussion. My comments are based on the discussions real people have about the subject but are reluctant to say because of a threat of being censored. So I ask again, why would any woman consider adding testosterone to her drug cocktail?

    Strength or increased muscle mass. Medical reasons including HRT, osteoporosis, renal failure.



    Mr. Sledge, are you a doctor of some sort? Even if you were you would be considered godly if you claim to have some greater understaning of the intricate female endocrine system than a biochemist or me, for that matter because I am a woman. And a walking lab rat who can talk about personal experiences.

    What exactly are you saying? You know more than endocrinologists or that you are an endocrinologist? Or are you a lab rat? Or both?

    What drugs do you use to stop your period?

    Birth control pills.


    I think Danazol is wonderful and plan to write an article about it. There are far less side affects than the more common HRT's prescribed. Birth control pills worked well at first but later proved counterproductive during contest prep.

    Are you referring to oestrogen being anabolic?

    I am Captain-Sav-a-Hoe in the flesh. But I only save those who want to be saved.
    I think I understand you sentiments, however, I think that you may be preaching to the converted.

    I think there are far more women who really don't have their diet or training sorted who are not physique athletes who are using steroids to 'tone up' or 'lose that bit of stubborn fat'.
    Last edited by Tatyana; 03-28-2009 at 07:26 PM.

  7. #22
    FREAK musclegoddess65's Avatar
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    Excellent info. Leigh.... I look forward to the rest of the series....
    Don't let the fear of the time it will take to accomplish something stand in the way of your doing it.

  8. #23
    FREAK Suzanne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carolyn Bryant View Post
    Like why are some of these women afraid to talk about using testosterone when they look like they eat it for breakfast, lunch and dinner? Sorry. Had to go there.
    How bout cuz it is illegal and people have lives outside of bodybuilding that maybe posting openly about doing things that are illegal isn't such a great idea and could ruin those lives

  9. #24
    The Fitness View Carolyn Bryant's Avatar
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    Thanks so much Sassy and Tatyana for engaging in conversation with me. I already understand the medical need for women to take testosterone. I studied it in school. I guess I should have posed the question differently. I figured out that test was probably cheaper than the other drugs after I sent the post and basically answered my own question. With that said, I just think there are far better compounds to take for strength and muscle gains than test.

    As a bodybuilding purist, I do not think that drugs of any kind are the best way to achieve those goals, period. By far the fastest, but still not the best. Not everyone is meant to be a competitive bodybuilder. It is a sport for the genetically gifted. At least it used to be.

    Birth control pills lost potency after awhile. At times elevated my blood pressure so I trashed em.

    No, I am not an endocrinologist. I'm just a very educated female who has struggled with estrogen dominace since puberty. I have done my own independent research on the subject and have drawn my own conclusions about what is best for me. Controlling my diet plays a huge part in my success.


    Yes, I am a walking lab rat. I was responding to the fella who called me ignorant when I pointed that out.

    Yes, there is a fair amount of research to conclude estros are anabolic. And many scientists believe as I do that women are able to make faster muscle gains due to the presence of estrogen. So again, I say using what your body already makes might be better than a male hormone. And that taking a male hormone in large amounts could cause you some serious problems later in life.

    There are some good drugs out there for non-athletes to reduce stubborn body fat. Phentermine is one of them if you don't mind losing a little muscle in the process. Dan Duchaine suggested that the exact doses of rat poison was great for reducing bodyfat and would allow you to eat at places like Dairy Queen daily and not get fat.

    No, I don't suggest any woman using any of the cycles outlined in the book Chemical Pink. It is a reference for any woman who wanted to hear from another women the pain and agony she experienced after getting involved with drugs. I recall she described her pain as losing herself in a world she barely understood for no good reason. I can give you many more names of current and retired bodybuilders who felt the same way. It proves nothing to argue with you about facts. But for your reference read the interviews with Kim, Lenda and Lesa Lewis to name a few since you minimize my conversations about the negative side of drugs to be mere folly.

  10. #25
    The Fitness View Carolyn Bryant's Avatar
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    Good point. But Leigh didn't need any names. She needed information for her story.

  11. #26
    Digital Marketing Manager, Team GAT SallyAnne's Avatar
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    Side effects are not folly and no one here ever said that they were. I think it's the way you callously stated that women who use test look like they eat it for breakfast, lunch, and dinner. It's a broad sweeping statement that has no value other than to show your disdain for women who take it.

    You are entitled to your opinions, but again - the idea here is to encourage all women to talk and learn about AAS usage. I ask that you withhold criticism and judgement of anyone and focus on the knowledge that Leigh has offered to share.

  12. #27
    Master Scribe Lee Penman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carolyn Bryant View Post
    Hey Leigh. That was a great article. I'm waiting to hear the secrets because those drugs you named are commonplace. However, I would have to disagree about Winstrol being safe for women. I think it is probably one of thee worst drugs on the planet for women. The jury is still out on low doses. But like any pharmacuetical, each individual responds diffferently to certain compounds. Thank you for pointing out the difference between the decas. Durabolin is the one I think is the devil. And women should never take it, period. Gotta mommy why question for ya. Like why are some of these women afraid to talk about using testosterone when they look like they eat it for breakfast, lunch and dinner? Sorry. Had to go there.
    Totally agree with you on the test. issue...there is more to come on that in future articles. Winstrol? You are right...a lot of women have a hard time with it but since it is cheaper than Anavar they still tend to substitute it from my research. Thanks for the feedback.

  13. #28
    The Fitness View Carolyn Bryant's Avatar
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    Thanks Leigh. I can't wait to read the follow up.

    Contrary to some belief, I am here to educate. I don't have to be fluffy in my approach. If femininity is not an issue then why do drugs like Sustanon, Anadrol, Parabolan, Masteron, DHT and Trembalone carry a label not reccomended for women? Perhaps some women use them anyway.
    There is a reason why these test derivatives are not widely used by women. Why not use DNP? Halotestin? As a former powerlifter, I happened to like that. Why are these drugs not considered "safe" for women? Perhaps they are too strong? What is the main concern by licensed health officials? Is it not mass destruction of our enodocrine system?

    When a woman starts speaking in baratone from fried vocal cords, shaving her face and her back daily and begins to develop a squared jawline and a enlarged forehead - those are signs of AAS abuse. I have yet to see any imperical data that forecasts what might happen later in life if you don't maintain "healthy" levels of estrogen in your body. As a bodybuilder I don't worry about Osteoporosis because I have way too much muscle density for that. But there could be other things lurking.

    How many women do their research about certain compounds before they take them. How can you disqualify certain drug contraindications? Too much Winstrol has been known to elevate blood pressure and destroy healthy cholesterol levels. Leigh didn't mention Clenbuterol, but it too is has the snake bite tag.

    Some of these women you speak of may be reading this right now saying, gosh Carolyn makes a valid point. I could be destroying my body and not know it. So that in fact makes my comments helpful.

    How empowering it is when a woman can say to a man "suck my dick" and mean it!

    Perhaps Leigh plans to discuss some of this in her next segment. I sure hope so.

  14. #29
    PENCILNECK Tatyana's Avatar
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    I understand what you are saying as I have seen far too many posts on BBing forums from women who are very concerned and a bit panicked about side effects.

    I also see so many women who are cardio fanatics yet still eat a protein depleted diet want to take steroids to gain more definition.

    There are also those so focused on their first contest, they will do ANYTHING to get on stage.

    Most of the time, when they have their mind set on it, they will do it, and no amount of logical advice will change their minds.

    Maybe there is a place for your style of communicating the information across, however I find that most just go somewhere to hear what they want to hear.

    It is important to get information regarding the safest use of steroids for women. For those that are unaware of some of the sides or don't want them, the consequences can be quite severe.

  15. #30
    Moderator GirlyMuscle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Carolyn Bryant View Post
    Thanks Leigh. I can't wait to read the follow up.

    Contrary to some belief, I am here to educate. I don't have to be fluffy in my approach. If femininity is not an issue then why do drugs like Sustanon, Anadrol, Parabolan, Masteron, DHT and Trembalone carry a label not reccomended for women? Perhaps some women use them anyway.
    There is a reason why these test derivatives are not widely used by women. Why not use DNP? Halotestin? As a former powerlifter, I happened to like that. Why are these drugs not considered "safe" for women? Perhaps they are too strong? What is the main concern by licensed health officials? Is it not mass destruction of our enodocrine system?

    When a woman starts speaking in baratone from fried vocal cords, shaving her face and her back daily and begins to develop a squared jawline and a enlarged forehead - those are signs of AAS abuse. I have yet to see any imperical data that forecasts what might happen later in life if you don't maintain "healthy" levels of estrogen in your body. As a bodybuilder I don't worry about Osteoporosis because I have way too much muscle density for that. But there could be other things lurking.

    How many women do their research about certain compounds before they take them. How can you disqualify certain drug contraindications? Too much Winstrol has been known to elevate blood pressure and destroy healthy cholesterol levels. Leigh didn't mention Clenbuterol, but it too is has the snake bite tag.

    Some of these women you speak of may be reading this right now saying, gosh Carolyn makes a valid point. I could be destroying my body and not know it. So that in fact makes my comments helpful.

    How empowering it is when a woman can say to a man "suck my dick" and mean it!


    Perhaps Leigh plans to discuss some of this in her next segment. I sure hope so.
    So that comment was necessary?

    While you are welcome to your opinion and you are welcome to voice it here at rxmuscle, this thread is about getting information out to women that they wouldn't normal have or would have a hard time finding. Start another thread if you want to argue morality and ethics.
    Last edited by GirlyMuscle; 03-29-2009 at 08:22 AM.
    You guys with the huge sponsor ads in your signatures make reading the forums annoying.

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