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  1. #61
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    Thanks for the feedback guys, appreciate the honesty. Just want to reiterate the point that I'm not in it to be a pro, I just love training. But a main part of that love is seeing progression, which I'm really struggling with now. I'd love to bring up those weaknesses, but I'm really not seeing progress lately. Comes back to that dilemma of juicing or finding a new hobby

  2. #62
    GYM RAT txhawkeyes's Avatar
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    Violator, if I was a young buck with an ego, I would post pictures.
    But,

    1- I was super skinny at 162, now I still see myself as pretty skinny at 195. So what's the point? I am not a body builder, I lift weights and try to add muscle. Also, I do 6-8 sets of 15 Hanging Wipers every time I walk into the gym. So there is very little fat around my waist.

    2- I am 47, have two kids, wife and I full time job, etc. I don't know HOW to post pictures, much less care.

    3- Like some guys, I don't have an ego and a need to throw out info to make myself seem cool. I really kind of an ugly guy, who is still about 20 pounds too skinny at 6'1", and just trying to offer what little help I have figured out over the last two years.

    4- Next show you are at, look for Uncle Attilla and ask him if I was really skinny two years ago, and if I am still pretty skinny (but 35-40 lbs heavier) now. He'll say yeah. 200 pounds for a guy that is 47, and 6'1" is nothing to brag about dude. But I'm a lot happier now than I was with where I was in a 32 waste and 38 L Jacket back two years ago.

    I'm not here to brag. I don't know that much, and I'm not that big.

  3. #63
    FREAK BC123Jm's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by txhawkeyes View Post
    Violator, if I was a young buck with an ego, I would post pictures.
    But,

    1- I was super skinny at 162, now I still see myself as pretty skinny at 195. So what's the point? I am not a body builder, I lift weights and try to add muscle. Also, I do 6-8 sets of 15 Hanging Wipers every time I walk into the gym. So there is very little fat around my waist.

    2- I am 47, have two kids, wife and I full time job, etc. I don't know HOW to post pictures, much less care.

    3- Like some guys, I don't have an ego and a need to throw out info to make myself seem cool. I really kind of an ugly guy, who is still about 20 pounds too skinny at 6'1", and just trying to offer what little help I have figured out over the last two years.

    4- Next show you are at, look for Uncle Attilla and ask him if I was really skinny two years ago, and if I am still pretty skinny (but 35-40 lbs heavier) now. He'll say yeah. 200 pounds for a guy that is 47, and 6'1" is nothing to brag about dude. But I'm a lot happier now than I was with where I was in a 32 waste and 38 L Jacket back two years ago.

    I'm not here to brag. I don't know that much, and I'm not that big.



    nothing wrong with a little ego old man (lol, i'm 40)
    sounds like you made some good progress. thats bragging rights.

  4. #64
    GYM RAT txhawkeyes's Avatar
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    Skinny,

    I have tried to have 4-5 protein shakes a day along with my 3-4 meals. Again, being a Dad, I can't just throw everything aside....this is a hobby.

    I do a lot of Hanging Wipers (ala a guy named Ben Booker) so I don't have much of anything around my waist. My Abs are covered a little with a little fat. Prob 14 % this week. The choc bar deal was given to me buy a guy named BBB from T Nation site. And it worked. At that particular time I was in the last 3 weeks of Meadows 4 day workout, what he calls his Deloading Phase. And he said I would add muscle in that phase. That probably helped..but aided by the choc bars and 40 g pre protein.

    I had luck with Carbo Gain from NOW, mixed in my post shake. That is something I was NEVER aware of at all till last Spring. Every new guy knows about protein powder...but Carbs in the post shake followed by food is essential for me. (they also make me feel bloated, but I have force in food after)

    I also talked to Jeff Neal, from Team Impact, about a year ago. He told me the old fashioned..."you will always have a little gut when you are gaining." I did for 9-10 months...and that may have helped too. But, now it's gone.


    I totally understand your frustration. I am a driven, German, Hardworking guy from the Northern Midwest. My problem with all that, is that I tend to overtrain. When I started leaving the gym after 50 minutes of lifting, resting more, and slowing my metabolism, it helped me a lot. I feel like at my age, I get 45 minutes of fuel to lift, then I quit. I usually have a 12 ounce of Apple Juice waiting in car, to help keep my Cortisol levels down per someone really smart, and to give me some Glucose for a little energy.

    And I eat like a guy who is really busy and has a family...not great. But on workout days...my pre shake 40 minutes before lifting is 2 Hershey bars, with 40 g protein mixed in milk with 2-3 heaping tbspns of Cocoa from the baking aisle, along with one purple KreAlkylin pill. Then my post when I get home is 20 g protein in milk, with 40 g waxy maize powder or Carbo Gain or some powdered carbs.

    Something in that schedule is working. While lifting I drink a lot of water. And I gave up on pre workout Superpumps and No Explodes....they wake me up at night too much. The chocolate thing...I'm not that smart. But look up old articles on guys who drink choc milk post workout...gotta be something there.

    Back to your frustration....the hardest thing I have done is slow down. It's against my norm, but I have been able to add muscle. And I never ever do cardio. Period.


    I hope something I wrote helps. Nothing that great, but maybe something will help. I "dare" you to try the choc bars and 40 g protein pre. See what happens. On the T Nation site, I and 4-5 other guys confirmed it doesn't add fat. You BURN everything in the bar in the gym.
    It's not like you are eating a jar of Mayonaise or something.....

  5. #65
    GYM RAT txhawkeyes's Avatar
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    Skinny,


    I looked at your pictures, and ignore my earlier post about setting a goal for 2015, staying away from idiots in the gym, etc. I'm sorry...you are

    WAY ahead of what I thought. I just saw that you only had 15 posts and assumed you were new to all of this. But your pictures are awesome. I probably can't add much....you are way ahead of me.

    The only thing I could tell you, is that the moment I eat a lot of food and start to develope a gut, the Hanging Wipers take it right off. So I don't do cardio and other stuff for fat loss. In my mind, the Wipers directly hit my one and only area that I put on fat. ? But in my mind, it's a VERY small place !


  6. #66
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    Thanks Hawk Eyes. I think the main point I can take from this personally is perhaps try and eat more and try some how to slow my metabolism.

    I'd also like to say that I've got a lot of admiration for guys like you who manage to balance their lifting / eating with family / work. Admittedly, I run a buisness so work about 10 hrs a day, usually 7 days a week, but I'm single and 24 and couldn't even imagine trying to have a girlfriend and train on top of that!

    I'm also a big fan of hanging wipers, and alternate them with hanging leg raises every session. At work I'm on my feet all day so don't do any cardio either. I hit the gym 4 days a week, first thing on a morning before work, so don't think I could stomach chocolate bars pre workout. Usually I just a have a shake and couple rice cakes in the car on the way to the gym, but I might try upping my post workout carbs with a Snickers or something.

    I train for 1 hr at a time, so an option for me might be to cut that down to 45 mins, and to reduce it from 4 sessions a week to 3 a week. I normally eat 4 times a day with 3 shakes on top, so might try and squeeze another meal / shake in there.
    Last edited by Skinnyrunt; 10-06-2011 at 02:22 PM.

  7. #67
    RX MEMBER cmeis90's Avatar
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    I'm natural right now but don't plan to be forever. I remember the days where I thought I could look like Jay Cutler eventually with just protein powder and enough hard work. It is really hard to motivate myself to keep on this road only gaining maybe 2 pounds a year. I admire naturals so much because it is so difficult to do.

    For me personally I feel it would be a waste to go like I am for for the next 25+ years and end up not looking anywhere where I want. I'm not saying with juice I'll get there either but I have a better shot. I lift religiously, sleep 8 hours at least a night, rarely party, don't drink or smoke, and eat the same meals everyday. I'm either big and fat or ripped and skinny depending on the diet. Its just not fun anymore and is frustrating. Again, much respect to life-time naturals, because they have to work harder than juicers and get much less results. I just don't see the point of that for me personally though.

  8. #68
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    Yeah man, feel ya. Was gonna add to my last post, if these changes still don't work then screw it, I'm either juicing it, or switching to golf or chess or, table tennis, synchronised swimming.....

  9. #69
    GYM RAT txhawkeyes's Avatar
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    Skinny,

    I just sent you an email, let me know if you get it. Not quite sure how this site does all that stuff, way over my head !


    Thanks.

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  11. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by txhawkeyes View Post
    Skinny,

    I just sent you an email, let me know if you get it. Not quite sure how this site does all that stuff, way over my head !


    Thanks.
    Hey bro, no my settings didn't allow for messages but I think I fixed that. Just sent you a message now.

    Thanks man

  12. #72
    NOVICE NaturalHardBody's Avatar
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    After 15 years of training i'm still progressing, but i have to admit that at the beginning i did a lot of mistakes, especially nutrition wise.

  13. #73
    Gym Mechanic seanmech's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NaturalHardBody View Post
    After 15 years of training i'm still progressing, but i have to admit that at the beginning i did a lot of mistakes, especially nutrition wise.
    Totaly agree, its not an easy road and to be shredded and still look like a bodybuilder is much harder

  14. #74
    Gym Mechanic seanmech's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skinnyrunt View Post
    Hey,
    Just curious to know how many out there are actually making real muscle gains? Is it even possible?

    From my personal experience, and from what I see daily, it seems that you will grow during your first 3 months or so of weight training only to plateau and not actually add muscle size there after.

    Now I'm talking about gains in muscle size here, not gains in strength. These in my opinion are different things. All too often I see guys who compete naturally go on their offseason bulk in which they'll up their carb intake, see their abs start to fade, and because the scales are going up and their strength is increasing they assume that their muscles are growing bigger. However, once they diet down for the next season they end up stepping on stage weighing and looking exactly as they did the year before!

    I see this happening over and over with so many people, so I really wanted to see if there are guys out there who are genuinely continuing to make natural gains. I need to have my faith in naturally bodybuilding restored!

    Thanks.
    6 months training

    6 years training, No body said it was easy! And there's no quick fix in the Natural game but thats 176lbs in 2004, and 238lbs in jan 2012

  15. #75
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    Did not read asides OP

    If you can't make gains naturally the only thing that'll happen when you get on gear is you'll put on a quick 10lb and lose it all when you come off. I was able to go from 136 to 197 naturally and maintain similar body fat in 3 years with no gear, so to anyone who thinks or says you can't put on gains naturally I call bullshit. You probably need to learn your body more and adjust your diet and training until you find what works for you so you know how to grow. Its not worth risking your health and man hood when you clearly have not come near maxing out your natural gains.

    If you want to see some of my pics from my glory days (136 lol) check on my log in the SNAC section


    http://forums.rxmuscle.com/showthrea...10#post1627710

    Last edited by Waylon; 03-04-2012 at 05:02 PM.

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