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04-04-2009, 09:40 AM #1
How much of a difference did steroids make to your physique?
I found this article by Bill Dobbins, and I thought it was quite interesting.
He claims that steroids only confer a 10-20% advantage.
I also read on another site that only 20% of men and even fewer women have the genetics to put on any significant amount of muscle without assistance.
There isn't any scientific documentation of any of these claims, or at least I haven't found any yet.
I thought this would be an interesting discussion, as it is quite obvious to me that there are some women who are just naturally muscular and really don't need to take anything, and there are those who have a lot more difficulty in putting on any size and feel the need for a bit of assistance.
Obviously it is all about choice.
Do you think you need to take performance enhancing drugs?
If you have, do you think it has made a significant difference to your physique?
However, research demonstrates that anabolic drugs like steroids give only a small percentage gain to the bodybuilding physique.
This has never been measured in bodybuilders per se –although the actual experience of bodybuilders tends to bear this out - but powerlifters have been shown to achieve less than a 20% increase in performance (and some of this due to the placebo effect) in non-tested competition compared to meets that are drug tested, and it seems that the longer the powerlifter has been training, the more mature the lifter is, the LESS relative benefit he gets from using steroids – often as little as 10%.
That is, the drugs help close the gap between performance and potential, but they don’t actually change the degree of genetically given potential. So even if bodybuilders are benefiting in their development by a full 20%, this means 80% if what they achieve is "natural."
And if mature bodybuilders, who have been training for decades (which includes most of the pros) only see about a 10% increase, this means 90% of their size and muscularity is due to genetics, hard training, consistency and good diet – and not drugs.
There is no research to indicate that this percentage of increase is any different for women than for men or that anabolic drugs give women significantly greater benefits than males.
Steroids, for example, are simply synthetic analogs of testosterone.
Men have about 100 times the amount of testosterone in their bodies as do women; they are not 100 times bigger or more muscular and women who take male hormones do not develop muscles 100 times larger.
There are a lot more physiological and biochemical factors governing the development of muscle than just hormones.
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04-04-2009, 12:22 PM #2
The article is too loose and broad. For most BBers, we don't know what there genetic baseline is and to throw around 10-20% sounds arbitrary. And, hey an "only" 20% gain for someone benching 300 would mean a jump to 360. Or, a lean 10-20% gain in mass on 200lbs is significant too. But again, it's too general and nearly impossible to determine. Years ago, I watched my friend pack on something like 40-50 pounds and his bench went from 405 to 500 on the old real Parabolan. We all have seen people's physiques transform before our eyes in the gym from AAS, who can really determine the degree to which it was beyonf genetic potential. What about a great physique like Kevion Levrone, who now look like an average joe? I also observed someone with terrible traps transform them into massive, ripped traps with an enanthate/Big A cycle. Who knows if it was a 10% or 20% gain over his genetic potential. We all now AAS is dramtatic in its results.
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04-04-2009, 09:48 PM #3
Bill sometimes says odd things. I experienced this first hand at a New Years party at Mentzer's about 12 years ago. My exwife and I got sucked into a conversation pit with him for over an hour. It took an act of desperation on my part to extricate us. I will say, however, he's mostly on target, he does know bodybuilding. I think he underestimates the effects of steroids on men with suboptimal test and especially on women. But its a very broad range- the bell curve again.
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04-12-2009, 03:49 AM #4
Thanks for the responses.
There is a distinct lack of women stating the effects of steroids on their physique.
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04-12-2009, 11:52 AM #5
Hey Tatyana,
While I have never taken AAS, I was curious what my trainer thought, if I tried anavar and GH, would it improve my physique. My trainers response was....my genetics are so-so, and while I may get slight improvement, it would be nothing that great. My genetics on a scale of 1-10 now are 5, to 6,and trying these things, would put me at about a 7 at best. My coach said I have the makings of a good local competitor, but not national level (which is fine with me) My coach felt the risks outweigh the benefits, why would I even try it. (especially with my medical hx..ie cancer twice)
I can say as part of HRT I used Estra-test for a period of 3 weeks, and it was awful! Lowest amount possible of testosterone, and I was getting acne, my hair was coming out, and I had horrible mood swings..just to name a few sides....Took about 1 month of stopping the HRT to see all the sides stop. Think I will just stick with the estrogen.
Sorry can't be much more help!
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04-12-2009, 12:29 PM #6
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04-12-2009, 01:04 PM #7
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04-12-2009, 02:28 PM #8
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I'm not sure anyone can really say how much steroid contributed to their physique. I say this because no too many people train to their genetic potential b/4 taking gear.
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04-13-2009, 12:18 PM #9
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04-13-2009, 12:31 PM #10
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Well let's look at the top natural... and then Ronnie Coleman...
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04-13-2009, 12:33 PM #11
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04-13-2009, 03:27 PM #12
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04-13-2009, 03:28 PM #13
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04-13-2009, 03:31 PM #14
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04-13-2009, 05:20 PM #15
Anabolics have helped me balance my physique out. I am still leg dominant, but have been able to hold on to a lot more size in my upper body while dieting down. I have not put on any "weight" on gear. I have only changed my body composition. Every year, I strive to be leaner at my weight. The drugs have helped me recover faster which is really one of the biggest reasons I started using to begin with.
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