If it fits your macros trend

[juiceinator3000]

Lol dude doesn't look even close to natty. Only time I had viens like that I was crushing the tren and EQ hard.

I will go out on a limb here and feel free to flame away but I'd say he is. I remember when he got his pro card. Added muscle but not enough to say he was hammering away on gear. And they test and we all know bold will show up in any test for a long ass period of time. Now gh and a few other short/no ester anabolics, possibly, but there are a few natty freaks out there. Check out Doug miller and whatever the fuck Ricardo's name is they both compete natural in ifpa. Two people I doubt use anything. I'm not naive, some people have great genetics for bb. Some of us are fucked and do it for fun. And let's be real here, steroids are awesome no doubt about that.

[Jake DeMichele]

Lol dude doesn't look even close to natty. Only time I had viens like that I was crushing the tren and EQ hard.

Another steroid user getting butthurt over Alberto's pictures... There's a natural kid in my gym who is 5'11 185 at 8% year round and has more veins than berto.. But I'm sure he's on tren and EQ also..

[flipmonk]

lol @ this thread....

IIFYM works! Period! Why? Because the people who use it do eat mainly CLEAN food and not junk. I followed a few guys on youtube who do the whole IIFYM thing. Basically they eat clean (eggs, chicken, beef, sweet potato and that good stuff) and track their macros with myfitnesspal.com; IF they have calories left at the end of the day they might something that most bodybuilders would consider junk BUT 95% of the foods they eat is clean.

check out matt ogus on youtube:

he has some cool videos and there's also a video with him and Eli Blahut. Matt does get crazy shredded and he's natural.

Alberto Nunez who most people here consider not-natural is actually one of his trainers. Matt works with 3DMJ which is a group of natural trainers and competitors. I'm gonna argue if Alberto is or isn't natural.
Ryan Dorris is also "natural" and he looks way bigger...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XhVCfAkzCKc&feature=plcp

[Triple-H_2005]

But that's not IIFYM....

You guys have spent pages extolling the virtues of being able to eat as one likes if it fits your macros.

So maybe it should be IIFYMAICEITOIWYWTLLABLAAG?

If It Fits Your Macros And Is Clean Except In The Occasional Instance When You Want To Let Loose A Bit Like At A Gathering...

Or are you telling me that eating clean 90-95% of the time and eating some occasional crap is okay? You know, like a traditional diet with the occasional cheat meal?

First of all, no one would advocate such an extreme: with soy vs. meat- you are getting different amino-acid profiles; when you are drinking tons of syrup, your body is not going to function optimally. But you can think of an extreme to question nearly anything(though this extreme really doesn't apply to begin with).

A much more realistic comparison would be eating a hamburger vs. tilapia, or eating some ice cream instead of rice; and maybe doing the equivalent of that with a few meals throughout the day. And if you adjusted portions accordingly to where the caloric intake as well as the protein intake of each matched up; you would see NO difference at all in your physique.

Another comparison would be eating 8 "clean" meals vs. eating a few big meals, each adding up to the same calorie/protein intake. You would not see a difference as far as body composition is concerned.

A good point brought up was health and feeling good. That is a concern; and what foods fit each person is going to be dependent on that person. But it is not the case that "high-glycemic", "dirty" foods are always going to make someone function less optimally-- especially when in moderation.

No one who advocates IIFYM-- a system, mind you, where you keep track of everything you take in and adjust it to fit pre-determined macronutrient requirements-- is just sitting around eating bacon and jelly sandwiches all day. It is not the easy way out; it is not careless; it's simply a sensible, flexible, founded approach to dieting.




Within reason, yes. But as far as energy-usage and protein synthesis go: if you are consuming a full spectrum of amino acids(as meat contain), you will have the building blocks for muscle synthesis; if you are consuming carbohydrates, they will be modified to go into glycolysis and produce ATP. Your body is diverse in what it can use and more-limited in how it can use it. Carbs from rice and carbs from bread are being modified into the exact same thing and producing energy proportional to it's energy content(which is 4kcal/g regardless of source).

Health is another issue. And that is why no one on IIFYM is going to the extremes mentioned above...indeed, no one would even desire to.

Read what you wrote.

For you, we'll call it IIFYMAPABAAPACFSNHFCS

If It Fits Your Macros And Provides A Broad Amino Acid Profile And Carbs From Sources Not HFCS.

You clowns are so all over the place with this that I don't even know where to begin!

[TheABomb]

I will go out on a limb here and feel free to flame away but I'd say he is. I remember when he got his pro card. Added muscle but not enough to say he was hammering away on gear. And they test and we all know bold will show up in any test for a long ass period of time. Now gh and a few other short/no ester anabolics, possibly, but there are a few natty freaks out there. Check out Doug miller and whatever the fuck Ricardo's name is they both compete natural in ifpa. Two people I doubt use anything. I'm not naive, some people have great genetics for bb. Some of us are fucked and do it for fun. And let's be real here, steroids are awesome no doubt about that.

People always have crazy genetics when it comes to size and strength and there will always be large differences in size an leanness. But the skin texture, massively large veins, etc are some obvious giveaways. You can never tell based on size and strength alone, unless of course they're 250+, faily lean, repping out 4 plates on the bench, etc etc..

Besides, Ricardo, Kiyoshi, they've all admitted to running "a few" cycles of methyltest, m1t, 1ad and all the good stuff back before it was considered "unnatural."

[TheABomb]

Another steroid user getting butthurt over Alberto's pictures... There's a natural kid in my gym who is 5'11 185 at 8% year round and has more veins than berto.. But I'm sure he's on tren and EQ also..

Actually, aas do increase rbc count, especially EQ - almost to the point where it's dangerously high. Hence the thick veins.

Or he could have just been admitted to the ER for iron poisoning a few times.

[OoFaP]

You guys have spent pages extolling the virtues of being able to eat as one likes if it fits your macros.

So maybe it should be IIFYMAICEITOIWYWTLLABLAAG?

If It Fits Your Macros And Is Clean Except In The Occasional Instance When You Want To Let Loose A Bit Like At A Gathering...

Or are you telling me that eating clean 90-95% of the time and eating some occasional crap is okay? You know, like a traditional diet with the occasional cheat meal?

IIFYM has restrictions. Certain other requirements need to be met which wouldn't be with your approach. You would be getting no vitamins, no fiber, etc. If you took everything in supplement form in addition to that then in terms of body composition, it would be the same. You would feel terrible though, have worse workouts, and probably get sick which would eventually affect body composition but the foods by themselves wouldn't.

I don't see the point in looking at the extremes. No one is advocating that. This is what I currently look like:



My diet for the past year has consisted of a lot of oats, lean turkey, chicken, eggs, broccoli, and peanut butter. On top of that, not a day has gone by where I didn't have either a bagel with cream cheese, a couple of hamburgers, or a burrito. I look a million times better now than when I was an obsessed freak who ate nothing but typical bodybuilder foods every couple of hours and chose to stay at home and eat rather than go places. But I must have elite genetics for it to work for me I guess. So either it works because we have good genetics or it works because we aren't actually natural. Open your mind and accept change. I cringe every time I see a fat out of shape bodybuilder forcing himself to eat nasty fish because he thinks he has to.

[MattyH7688]

not trying to advocate it 100%, but I will admit this offseason every single day I had one meal at least of chipotle, subway, this amazing burger place at my GF's college WVU, Wendys, some nice restaurant for dinner etc.. I stayed my leanest this offseason, compared to every other offseason I had where I pretty much only ate "bodybuilding" foods. I use to be the biggest proponent of it.. Now I doubt I will do this dieting, maybe due to my own OCD with it. But it made enjoy life a bit more with no real difference in gains.

[TheABomb]

If I trained for a marathon, dropped 80lbs, ate bagels and hamburgers every day, did 2 hours of cardio a day, I could also be 160 with striated glutes. Just saying...

[OoFaP]

If I trained for a marathon, dropped 80lbs, ate bagels and hamburgers every day, did 2 hours of cardio a day, I could also be 160 with striated glutes. Just saying...

Idiotic and ignorant statement just like 80% of the posts in this thread. MD and RX members are sadly the reason that the general population views bodybuilders so negatively.

[Diggy]

IIFYM has restrictions. Certain other requirements need to be met which wouldn't be with your approach. You would be getting no vitamins, no fiber, etc. If you took everything in supplement form in addition to that then in terms of body composition, it would be the same. You would feel terrible though, have worse workouts, and probably get sick which would eventually affect body composition but the foods by themselves wouldn't.

I don't see the point in looking at the extremes. No one is advocating that. This is what I currently look like:



My diet for the past year has consisted of a lot of oats, lean turkey, chicken, eggs, broccoli, and peanut butter. On top of that, not a day has gone by where I didn't have either a bagel with cream cheese, a couple of hamburgers, or a burrito. I look a million times better now than when I was an obsessed freak who ate nothing but typical bodybuilder foods every couple of hours and chose to stay at home and eat rather than go places. But I must have elite genetics for it to work for me I guess. So either it works because we have good genetics or it works because we aren't actually natural. Open your mind and accept change. I cringe every time I see a fat out of shape bodybuilder forcing himself to eat nasty fish because he thinks he has to.

Can you post up an example of a typical day of eating for you please? Thanks

[TheABomb]

Idiotic and ignorant statement just like 80% of the posts in this thread. MD and RX members are sadly the reason that the general population views bodybuilders so negatively.

Go back to bb.com why don't you, the mecca of training and nutrition knowledge then..

[OoFaP]

Can you post up an example of a typical day of eating for you please? Thanks

Sure. This is what I'm eating now. I lowered calories by about 500 last month to drop 5-8 pounds for summer. I already dropped the weight so now I'm just maintaining. I have it organized in 5 meals but the majority of the time it's combined into only 4 meals. I just have it written out in Excel like this.

Meal 1

2 eggs

120g oats

36 g Myofusion

Meal 2

120 g oats

6 oz turkey(raw)

200 grams broccoli

Meal 3

4 oz sirloin beef

Thomas WW Bagel

16 g PB

Pepperidge Farms Bun

Meal 4

4 oz sirloin beef

Pepperidge Farms Bun

Apple

Meal 5

33 g ON casein

10 g PB

2 eggs

[TheABomb]

Let's be honest. Lots of juiced bodybuilders resent naturals because they often come in leaner. 98% of people on this board haven't been as lean as guys like Berto, Brian Whitacre, Brandon Bergen....I could go on.. I can't wait until one of your juiced superheros reps using IIFYM and everyone's on the bandwagon.. The chooo choooo train will be arriving shortly.

And the funny thing is if any of you saw these guys in person you would believe they are natural. It's amazing how dieting for 24+ weeks and taking an HD photo by yourself can be so deceiving to the mind.

I'd rather be a fucking fatass and deadlift over 600 than walk around at 160 with striated glutes....

I don't think any enhacned bodybuilders gives 2 shits about how some 150lb natural bodybuilder looks on stage...

[TheABomb]

Lol at Alberto using PEDs and lol at this thread, if you think that your digestive system can differentiate between types of carbs, protein and fats then you need to read a physiology textbook haha. Heathwise maybe food source matters, but body composition wise not at all, this is proven by numerous guys who have got lean using iifym

Oh ok, so what about medium chain vs long chain fatty acids? Omega 3's, 6's, 9's, the glycemic index for carbohydrates, GI inflammation caused by certain types of gains, complete vs incomplete protiens, food processing, etc etc? All meaningless I suppose...