share your experiences

[AndroGrrL]

Andro you need to call me. I wanna hear your voice.

lol that just sounded funny...like we're LOVAHHHH's

haha okay, I'll try to make time tomorrow...I still have your #! It's not as cool as one would think...

and yeah, I was off for 2 years...def never went back...

[AndroGrrL]

I've used Prop....but never have lasted on it for more than 4 weeks...so I'm not sure that my experience is that accurate.

I ran 15-20 EOD...no break outs...slight water retention but nothing that I thought was too terrible. Strength went up a little...but to be honest, if I ever ran it again, I'd try a little more. I just didn't see anything too great (or bad) happen on the dosage that I took...but then again, the short time span may have been the issue.

[sassy69]

I think something like Prop is going to take longer just to 'establish itself' for the sort of results you're expecting. Similarly primo can take 5 weeks to get going and eq on the order of 6-8 weeks. I'm not sure how you arrive at those 'start up periods', but anecodotally that's what you're looking at.

Another part of the discussion might also be WHY you choose this or that compound and where in your cycle you put it. E.g. the longer esters you're probably going to put in a bulker cycle whereas the fast-acting stuff like winny & var, possibly tren, you'd be looking at for cutting for a show as well as for their non-converting status. On a bulker, you'd probably be less likely to be concerned about water retention, or for competition, you'd be looking to drop your injectibles, or basically anything that makes you retain water, at least 10 days before show day so the water retention can clear.

[tammyp]

i think the ONLY thing that doesnt effect voice is var. really....

[~gymdiva~]

I thought I had seen an opinion somewhere but now I can't find it...thoughts and opinions on proviron? more for prep? could be used with something like winny/var/primo as a bulking agent? "useless" for females for the most part?

[sassy69]

I thought I had seen an opinion somewhere but now I can't find it...thoughts and opinions on proviron? more for prep? could be used with something like winny/var/primo as a bulking agent? "useless" for females for the most part?

Why would you use it for a bulking cycle? Its primarily an androgen and not an anabolic. Guys use it to kickstart their natural test.

[~gymdiva~]

well that was my thought...just aiding in boosting natural test...haven't really studied it which was why I asked...

[Carolyn Bryant]

Winny fucks with everyone's voice for a period of time. With the exception of heavy usage, your voice WILL return to normal once you go off. You have to be smart about it though. I took winny during prep in 07 and I was froggy toward the end - constantly having to clear my throat. My voice cam back to normal in a short period of time, though.

Just FYI - all AAS can have an effect on your voice. Winny just seems to be a little more pronounced.

You should stop giving out bad info. Once the vocal cords are eroded that damage is permanent. The severity of the erosion varies.

More FYI...
Dr. Redmond and others believe that excess androgens are a far more pressing health problem than their diminution. By far, the bulk of the new research is focused on disorders that arise when a woman's body generates too much testosterone, resulting in everything from cosmetic problems like acne, balding and the growth of facial hair so abundant that the woman must shave twice a day to more severe complications like infertility, diabetes, high blood pressure, heart disease and cancer of the uterus. Even some cases of breast cancer, a disease normally associated with too much estrogen, may in fact be the result of excess testosterone, several experts said, although the data on this remain sketchy.
Researchers said the incidence of androgen disorders in women has been grossly underestimated, and that as many as 15 to 30 percent of all women may have problems caused by the overproduction of testosterone, an excessive sensitivity to the influence of circulating androgens, or both. They suggest that doctors should be on the lookout for women -- and even young girls -- who may be suffering from excess androgen secretion, so that the patients can be treated early enough to prevent the onset of serious and possibly fatal complications of a lifetime of androgen overdosing.

[SallyAnne]

You should stop giving out bad info. Once the vocal cords are eroded that damage is permanent. The severity of the erosion varies.

More FYI...
Dr. Redmond and others believe that excess androgens are a far more pressing health problem than their diminution. By far, the bulk of the new research is focused on disorders that arise when a woman's body generates too much testosterone, resulting in everything from cosmetic problems like acne, balding and the growth of facial hair so abundant that the woman must shave twice a day to more severe complications like infertility, diabetes, high blood pressure, heart disease and cancer of the uterus. Even some cases of breast cancer, a disease normally associated with too much estrogen, may in fact be the result of excess testosterone, several experts said, although the data on this remain sketchy.
Researchers said the incidence of androgen disorders in women has been grossly underestimated, and that as many as 15 to 30 percent of all women may have problems caused by the overproduction of testosterone, an excessive sensitivity to the influence of circulating androgens, or both. They suggest that doctors should be on the lookout for women -- and even young girls -- who may be suffering from excess androgen secretion, so that the patients can be treated early enough to prevent the onset of serious and possibly fatal complications of a lifetime of androgen overdosing.

I believe the thread reads "personal experience".

Let me break it down for you. I took very small amounts of winny that made me froggy for a short period of time, and within a few weeks of stopping, the frogginess went away. I didn't take a lot and I didn't take it for a long time. That's right! Back to normal. If you don't have a personal experience to share, this is not the thread for you.

[sassy69]

well that was my thought...just aiding in boosting natural test...haven't really studied it which was why I asked...

Would boosting natural test matter that much if you're on a cycle where you are introducing exogenous amounts orders of magnitude larger than your own natural levels?

For what it does, the recommended place for proviron in a cycle is at the final cutting stage, and according to Anabolics 200x, for no more than 8 weeks.

[sassy69]

You should stop giving out bad info. Once the vocal cords are eroded that damage is permanent. The severity of the erosion varies.

At what point is "erosion" considered "eroded" vs not sure how you'd describe... "affected"? I'm curious, for ex, if a singer who can hit good quality high notes, does one non-aggressive round of primo and never again. Are the vocal chords eroded? I.e. would this person show impaired ability to hit good quality high notes forever more? This is what you hear about 1-time winny cycles -- the voice is affected, even if the more blatant frogginess, etc. goes back to "normal" when the DHT presence clears. It is possible that the measureable degrees of 'erosion' are only more apparent, even after small amounts, in the extreme use of voice, such as hitting good quality high notes?

[AndroGrrL]

I believe the thread reads "personal experience".

Let me break it down for you. I took very small amounts of winny that made me froggy for a short period of time, and within a few weeks of stopping, the frogginess went away. I didn't take a lot and I didn't take it for a long time. That's right! Back to normal. If you don't have a personal experience to share, this is not the thread for you.

I have read before that winny (and other aas) can temporarily thicken your vocal chords which changes the pitch...but it can eventually go back to normal.

Not that mine is normal, but my mom told me my voice sounded like it was less...'rough' then it was when I was actually on.

Shit, I've even read about a surgery to fix your vocal chords and change the pitch of your voice. Eh, I'm fine with what I have

[partsRheavy]

There is some natural deepening of the voice that happens as most women age. I notice that the time that happens is really variable with different people but seems to usually happen in women's 40s or 50s, and is dependent on habits like smoking.

Having little talent in music (bombed out of choir as a kid), I have only amateur observations, but here goes...

I notice that female rock DJ's often have deep voices. Usually if there's a female DJ on an album-oriented station, she has a deep voice. (Whereas Top40 or Adult Contemporary the voice is more high-pitched).

I've heard deep voiced female DJ's on several album-oriented rock stations both in the Southeast and in California years ago. I usually just attribute that to either voice training for a "sexy" voice or to too much smoking, drinking and partying. But who knows, maybe these rock dj's are juicing to get that Rock'n'Roll sound?!?

Another gal in radio who has a _slightly_ deep voice is digital diva Kim Komando. News anchor Connie Chung's voice is medium-deep.

By contrast, Dr. Laura and women in commercials usually have high-pitched voices.

I definitely believe that voice quality is a major issue for any younger woman, and for women who sing or communicate on the job and with the public a lot. It's sort of tied in with image and the type of job or social role someone has. In other words, the preacher's wife might be very concerned about maintaining a modulated soprano voice, whereas a warehouse worker might be a little more casual in her attitude toward her voice.

Obviously any woman even contemplating steroids needs to think about how she uses her voice and what she would think if it were deeper than the usual.

[Lee Penman]

I have read before that winny (and other aas) can temporarily thicken your vocal chords which changes the pitch...but it can eventually go back to normal.

Not that mine is normal, but my mom told me my voice sounded like it was less...'rough' then it was when I was actually on.

Shit, I've even read about a surgery to fix your vocal chords and change the pitch of your voice. Eh, I'm fine with what I have

I have heard of some top pros from years past having their vocal chords 'shaved' to restore normal pitch. Plus Proviron produces too much DHT for women in my opinion. What this means is hair loss and acne.
As to vocal chords returning to normal... I think this is a rare occurance.

[ms.karen]

I thought I had seen an opinion somewhere but now I can't find it...thoughts and opinions on proviron? more for prep? could be used with something like winny/var/primo as a bulking agent? "useless" for females for the most part?

Not sure what to think about Proviron. At 12.5 mg ED it produced some really good looking hard muscle within just a few days...literally! But it also added about a half pound per day. When that half pound/day turned into 7 lbs, it was a bit too much mentally so the cycle was stopped. The hard muscle gains lasted about 5 days after the cycle stopped...very disappointing.