Protein Powder or Aminos?

JohnBoy · 07-23-2010, 07:41 AM

Before I get flamed to high hell for initially sounding like a fool (I do understand you can take both and MANY people do), why not just supplement with EAA's or even BCAA's in larger quantities rather than take protein powder? Doesn't protein powder break down into amino acids anyway? Maybe throw in some glutamine too for good measure with it. Theoretically speaking, wouldn't it help spur growth quicker seeing as it would be broken down further?

Which do you use and why?

Rattbones · 07-23-2010, 08:30 AM

I switched to BCAA's about 7 months ago. I have not lost any muscle mass, and noticed my recovery is much better.

lomox · 07-23-2010, 08:33 AM

ALR believes this.

JohnBoy · 07-23-2010, 08:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rattbones

I switched to BCAA's about 7 months ago. I have not lost any muscle mass, and noticed my recovery is much better.

About how many grams do you take? Separately or in a mixture? Have you noticed more gains as opposed to powder?

VanillaGorilla · 07-23-2010, 09:10 AM

horses dont eat protein powder and they have plenty of mass

NPCKnight · 07-23-2010, 09:27 AM

Humapro and Chaind Out are still amazing me daily.

Protein powders I have not consumed for almost a year now.

Jason Newman · 07-23-2010, 10:34 AM

i think they both have their place, i switched to pure Peptopro, which is di and tripepetides its hydrolyzed casein, faster than aminos and i didnt lose a lb, in fact i recomped on it and a halodrol clone and lost 4%bf and only 1lb total in 6weeks,

i dropped my protein intake way down i cut out ~80g protein and didnt lose anything, my shakes were 20-26g Maximum absorbed protein (which is two scoops) and 2-3 whole food meals a day

(fyi the halodrol clone was turinabol LV by primordial, dosages were 60mg for week1 then 75 mg for week 2&3, then to 90mg for the weeks 4-6)

JohnBoy · 07-23-2010, 11:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NPCKnight

Humapro and Chaind Out are still amazing me daily.

Protein powders I have not consumed for almost a year now.

I love chaind Out. Don't know much about HumaPro and I'm a bit skeptical to say the least.

Quote:

Originally Posted by VanillaGorilla

horses dont eat protein powder and they have plenty of mass

I didn't know horses could type.

PTB · 07-23-2010, 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnBoy

Before I get flamed to high hell for initially sounding like a fool (I do understand you can take both and MANY people do), why not just supplement with EAA's or even BCAA's in larger quantities rather than take protein powder? Doesn't protein powder break down into amino acids anyway? Maybe throw in some glutamine too for good measure with it. Theoretically speaking, wouldn't it help spur growth quicker seeing as it would be broken down further?

Which do you use and why?

Fair question - even for those using humapro.

joshbarnett · 07-23-2010, 12:01 PM

lba's

Minnphat · 07-23-2010, 12:33 PM

I stopped using isolyze about two weeks ago.... I now do all whole meals and humapro.... I stopped getting headaches.... I am less hungry.... and my stomach is a lil less destendid... I will never use protein powder again....

Growin24/7 · 07-23-2010, 12:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Minnphat

I stopped using isolyze about two weeks ago.... I now do all whole meals and humapro.... I stopped getting headaches.... I am less hungry.... and my stomach is a lil less destendid... I will never use protein powder again....

same here...except i do take CO/hp 5 scoops of co and 15 hp pills daily, have lost tons of unwanted water weight and i feel much harder yet fuller, pretty damn cool to me, it's gotta be what 3-4 months now since i have had a protein shake and i have not lost and muscle mass whatsoever

Costco77 · 07-23-2010, 07:35 PM

Keep your eye out for HICA.

It's a Leucine metabolite that helps prevent muscle breakdown studies also show an increase in muscle mass. "HICA, is formed when leucine is completely broken down, has also been reported to inhibit muscle loss by blocking the action of certain catabolic compounds."

http://www.ergo-log.com/hica.html

http://www.ironmagazineforums.com/su...upplement.html

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/m.../ai_n39368993/

Could be the next big supplement...Muscle Tech is the only supplement that i can find that uses HICA, they use it in the original Anablic Halo and their amino prototype, check it out.

TUFF · 07-24-2010, 07:39 AM

So if you use whole meals and shakes are you eliminating shakes and replacing the shake meals with BCAA's? or using BCAA's and more whole food meals?
I wonder what the calorie difference is between a shake and replacing it with BCAA's.

ADRAKE21 · 07-24-2010, 11:00 AM

how many grams of bcaa's would be enough to replace protein powder throughout the day?

Growin24/7 · 07-24-2010, 11:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ADRAKE21

how many grams of bcaa's would be enough to replace protein powder throughout the day?

depends on weight really...i do about 7g. x's 5 a day instead of 3 protein shakes a day and that held all my muscle mass and I weighed 235lbs....keep in mind i eat 6 meals a day

Shariff Abel · 07-24-2010, 11:16 AM

I take nothing just plain food !

I keep my muscle and even gained.
I used to drink 4 shakes a day , and i haven't lost any muscle since i completely stop'd the shakes. its bee a 1 year.

Its all marketing don't fall for the trap!

chris mason · 07-24-2010, 12:40 PM

With the price of wholesale whey skyrocketing (and therefore the retail price - if you haven't seen it yet, wait a few weeks) I would have to say BCAAs.

thesamewords · 07-24-2010, 01:01 PM

The easiest way to avoid this nonsense of supplementation is by developing a solid whole food nutritional foundation. Once that is fine tuned you may realize supps arent entirely what they seem to be.

GENESIS · 07-24-2010, 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NPCKnight

Protein powders I have not consumed for almost a year now.

GENESIS · 07-24-2010, 01:22 PM

I use amino's and protein powders. When it comes down to the potential of stimulating protein synthesis, more is ALWAYS better.

jacshelb · 07-24-2010, 01:45 PM

I was listening to an am radio show awhile back and there was a guy talking about how if we don't properly breakdown protein into aminos then we absorb the protein as protein into our bodies and we weren't made to do this and it can cause problems down the line. (i.e. instead of breaking it down into useable aminos, we're taking on actual protein he was saying) . That got me thinking about amino acids a lot more. I use some pre/during workout but that's about it.

The only reason I use protein powder right now is that I'm lazy and like making a shake for breakfast: skim milk, frozen berries, flax seed, protein powder, 3 whole eggs, sugar free metameucil. It's like a good meal and actually tastes pretty good too. I get sick to my stomach if I try to eat solid food first thing in the morning, so I sip a shake like that. Also good if you're in a hurry. Not all of us have unlimited time. With families, business, friends etc. meals can take a backseat once and again.

Warped · 07-24-2010, 02:04 PM

I use powders because it is better and cheaper.

Wheels · 07-24-2010, 02:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warped

I use powders because it is better and cheaper.

Gee, what a compelling argument.

I used to use Whey in addition to basic supplements i.e. Creatine, Beta-Alanine, BCAAs, Caffeine, Vit C, Joint Supp, and a Multi. A couple months ago I took the whey out and now eat 6 whole food meals a day; the difference is like night and day.

Maybe there's truth to what Author says in regards to Whey, I don't know enough about the science to say for sure or not. What I do know, is I've easily made the best progress since omitting the Whey for whole foods.

So, yea, I would most definitely opt for BCAAs and whole foods, OP.

mrusa85 · 07-24-2010, 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wheels

Gee, what a compelling argument.

I used to use Whey in addition to basic supplements i.e. Creatine, Beta-Alanine, BCAAs, Caffeine, Vit C, Joint Supp, and a Multi. A couple months ago I took the whey out and now eat 6 whole food meals a day; the difference is like night and day.

Maybe there's truth to what Author says in regards to Whey, I don't know enough about the science to say for sure or not. What I do know, is I've easily made the best progress since omitting the Whey for whole foods.

So, yea, I would most definitely opt for BCAAs and whole foods, OP.

What is a night-and-day difference? What specifically did you notice? Strength went up? Gained musce size? Less water retention? What?

Wheels · 07-24-2010, 06:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mrusa85

What is a night-and-day difference? What specifically did you notice? Strength went up? Gained musce size? Less water retention? What?

Size, strength, energy - you name it. My weights have sky rocketed since using whole foods in lieu of Whey. I find the muscle has a significantly better look to it, much fuller. My energy is much better and I find recovery from workouts has been expedited. I simply just feel better eating whole foods. For the record, I'm not talking about bloat or feeling queasy on Whey as I never experienced either of those.

The change was almost over night, in the way I felt. I changed nothing else in my regiment other than eliminating Whey, so it is the only thing I can chalk this up to. IF what Author says is true about Whey, then it's easy to see why the above happened. If not, then all I can say is going natural always seems to be the best course these days.

TUFF · 07-26-2010, 07:09 PM

if you eat six whole food meals I doubt you need any extra BCAA's.

I eat 3 or 4 real meals and have 2 or 3 shakes. I thought you guys were saying I could drop the shakes and eat 3 or 4 real meals and just take several large doses of BCAA's to replace the shakes.

chris mason · 07-26-2010, 07:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wheels

Size, strength, energy - you name it. My weights have sky rocketed since using whole foods in lieu of Whey. I find the muscle has a significantly better look to it, much fuller. My energy is much better and I find recovery from workouts has been expedited. I simply just feel better eating whole foods. For the record, I'm not talking about bloat or feeling queasy on Whey as I never experienced either of those.

The change was almost over night, in the way I felt. I changed nothing else in my regiment other than eliminating Whey, so it is the only thing I can chalk this up to. IF what Author says is true about Whey, then it's easy to see why the above happened. If not, then all I can say is going natural always seems to be the best course these days.

A couple of points:

First, I actually made a video blog which talks about the fact supplemental protein is really only effective in the Western world for post-workout purposes (and even then as a convenience as opposed to a necessity) and in the case of someone on a hypo-caloric diet. In addition, whey only protein supplements really are inferior for any purpose (though they are not ineffective or 'bad').

Next, you are mistaking the reason for the changes you have seen. What you are describing sounds like you were in a caloric deficit and no longer are, or at the very least, you were not consuming enough calories overall to be in an anabolic state. The fact you upped your food intake almost invariably means you upped your total caloric intake.

Wheels · 07-26-2010, 10:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chris mason

A couple of points:

First, I actually made a video blog which talks about the fact supplemental protein is really only effective in the Western world for post-workout purposes (and even then as a convenience as opposed to a necessity) and in the case of someone on a hypo-caloric diet. In addition, whey only protein supplements really are inferior for any purpose (though they are not ineffective or 'bad').

Next, you are mistaking the reason for the changes you have seen. What you are describing sounds like you were in a caloric deficit and no longer are, or at the very least, you were not consuming enough calories overall to be in an anabolic state. The fact you upped your food intake almost invariably means you upped your total caloric intake.

Exactly right, I presume it was a calorie increase because the body does not utilize the whey correctly (this sort of corroborates what Author said); essentially wasted calories and wasted protein.

So, if the body isn't utilizing Whey the way it should, then with the addition of two (sometimes 3 chicken breasts) in lieu of the protein would make a huge impact.

chris mason · 07-26-2010, 11:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wheels

Exactly right, I presume it was a calorie increase because the body does not utilize the whey correctly (this sort of corroborates what Author said); essentially wasted calories and wasted protein.

So, if the body isn't utilizing Whey the way it should, then with the addition of two (sometimes 3 chicken breasts) in lieu of the protein would make a huge impact.

Well, no, I think Author is barking up the wrong tree if he wants to say that somehow the body does not absorb or utilize whey protein supplements. That is just silly marketing b.s., or a misunderstanding on his part.

What I am saying is that 1 serving of most protein powders is just over 100 cals. That is not a lot of calories, and if you upped your food intake you very likely are now consuming a lot more calories than you were previously hence your gains.